about Kansas

[Justin_Simpleton]

I had an exciting battle with Kansas yesterday.  It was a standard battle where I had to rush to our base to defend against a DD while the rest of the team was trying to take the enemy's base.  The part where it took four minutes to reach our base in a cyclone was not exciting.  I killed the DD, saved the win, and died.

So, I messed around a little trying make a video of the battle in a faster speed but the resolution was pretty bad.  So, I looked on YT to see how others handled showing the Kansas.  All the videos are long with a lot of excitement right at the end.

That's the thing about Kansas it's boring to watch or play until right at the end of the battle where it shines.  The end of the battle is where the Kansas is chasing CVs and chewing up planes.  The end of the battle is where the Kansas takes a bunch of torpedo hits and kills the last enemy ship.  The battles end with Kansas earning citadel ribbons and lots of potential dmg.  It can rack up a lot of damage if you are willing to use HE appropriately.  It's a good sub killer, too.

[CFagan_1987]

I can't get past the slow speed and low ROF of that particular line ... when I got the North Carolina after grinding the Colorado it was like a breath of fresh air!

Edited April 20 by CFagan_1987

[Admiral_Karasu]

@Justin_Simpleton

Quote

I had an exciting battle with Kansas yesterday.  It was a standard battle where I had to rush to our base to defend

lol

[mashed68]

I quite like Kansas. Not as much as my massachusettes though so I rarely play her. 

[AdmiralThunder]

The end of the battle is when Kansas finally makes it out of spawn and loads the guns. 😎

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

3 hours ago, Admiral_Karasu said:

@Justin_Simpleton

lol

Given the pace of play at tier 10, I have to take care not to overextend with Kansas...

Her speed isn't as much of a handicap as most people think.

[Admiral_Karasu]

7 minutes ago, AdmiralThunder said:

The end of the battle is when Kansas finally makes it out of spawn and loads the guns. 😎

 

6 minutes ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

Given the pace of play at tier 10, I have to take care not to overextend with Kansas...

Her speed isn't as much of a handicap as most people think.

 

There seems to be some agreement that Kansas plays a decisive role then.

[DoW_]

Brisk ftw. 

[pepe_trueno]

i want to like that line but both kansas and minnesota feel underwhelming mostly because they are supposed to trade reload and mobility for a heavy broadside yet their guns don't feel accurate enough. This is particularly true for kansas since it does not have access to accuracy mod.

i dont mind the slow speed but 40 seconds reload just to see the shells go all over the place is painful.

 

 

[Admiral_Karasu]

12 minutes ago, pepe_trueno said:

i want to like that line but both kansas and minnesota feel underwhelming mostly because they are supposed to trade reload and mobility for a heavy broadside yet their guns don't feel accurate enough. This is particularly true for kansas since it does not have access to accuracy mod.

i dont mind the slow speed but 40 seconds reload just to see the shells go all over the place is painful.

 

 

So how is Kansas supposed to work? Is the idea to get up close and personal or something?

[Justin_Simpleton]

21 minutes ago, Admiral_Karasu said:

So how is Kansas supposed to work? Is the idea to get up close and personal or something?

You can get up close and tank a lot while fending off attack planes.  You can bait torpedos with its excellent turning ability.  Otherwise, play it like Yamato and snipe to keep the enemy ships away from the cap.  The guns are accurate for me.

[pepe_trueno]

48 minutes ago, Admiral_Karasu said:

So how is Kansas supposed to work? Is the idea to get up close and personal or something?

the armor is not that good to fight from close range, lets compare it to bismarck that has similar AP DPM

taken from ship tool

ship             guns                  AP DPM    HE DPM   AP salvo  HE salvo  range       reload    Ho./Ve. disp.  sigma

Kansas

.

4×3 406 mm

212,400

102,600

141,600

68,400

22.7 km

40.0 s

180 m

91 m

1.7

Bismarck

4×2 380 mm

214,154

81,231

92,800

35,200

21.2 km

26.0 s

180 m

92 m

1.8

North C.

3×3 406 mm

235,800

102,600

117,900

51,300

23.3 km

30.0 s

210 m

111 m

2.05

bismarck has much better speed, armor and secondary guns.  kansas in the other hand has better burst damage, AA and acceleration but with accuracy being average and no accuracy mod  the burst damage is a hit or miss so you dont want to be at close range miss the salvo and then be there stuck for 40 seconds getting beaten 😅 

 

slow turret traverse does not help either if you want to fight from close range.

Edited April 20 by pepe_trueno

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

1 hour ago, pepe_trueno said:

i want to like that line but both kansas and minnesota feel underwhelming mostly because they are supposed to trade reload and mobility for a heavy broadside yet their guns don't feel accurate enough. This is particularly true for kansas since it does not have access to accuracy mod.

i dont mind the slow speed but 40 seconds reload just to see the shells go all over the place is painful.

 

 

It's like the New Mexico...12 guns means accuracy isn't quite as important.

The slow reload is what hurts the most.

But you have a really maneuverable hull for armor angling for 'in close'.

1 hour ago, Admiral_Karasu said:

So how is Kansas supposed to work? Is the idea to get up close and personal or something?

Not really.

You are a very powerful artillery weapon.

Play it like New Mexico.

[mashed68]

Kansas can accelerate and turn very fast. Its broadside is heavy. Its AA is strong. I pick it in a close in brawl over the North Carolina. 

 

[Unlooky]

Just now, Admiral_Karasu said:

So how is Kansas supposed to work? Is the idea to get up close and personal or something?

You basically advance as far as you can safely (if you get overrun you're not getting away) and look for a broadside to smash. Kansas sucks at this compared to it's successors because it doesn't have the American accuracy mod or actual armor (the ship is covered in 32mm, while Minnesota is covered in 38, and Vermont has a 51mm deck.) 

The ship is absolutely god awful. 

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

3 minutes ago, Unlooky said:

You basically advance as far as you can safely (if you get overrun you're not getting away) and look for a broadside to smash. Kansas sucks at this compared to it's successors because it doesn't have the American accuracy mod or actual armor (the ship is covered in 32mm, while Minnesota is covered in 38, and Vermont has a 51mm deck.) 

The ship is absolutely god awful. 

Eh.

It's not terrible.

You can still have fun with it.

[Unlooky]

Just now, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

Eh.

It's not terrible.

You can still have fun with it.

Perhaps you can. 

I found her successors far more enjoyable. 

[pepe_trueno]

22 minutes ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

 

But you have a really maneuverable hull for armor angling for 'in close'.

 

ship turning rate is great for dodging torpedoes but the turrets have slow turn and cant keep up with ship turning so if you start wiggling in a brawl don't be surprised turrets will be off the mark when you need them the most.

also the armor is okish. "thick torpedo armor" can make the ship quite tanky at times  but outside that is still covered in 32mm.

Edited April 20 by pepe_trueno

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

Just now, pepe_trueno said:

ship turning rate is great for dodging torpedoes but the turrets have slow turn and cant keep up with ship turning so if you start wiggling in a brawl don't be surprised turrets will be off the mark when you need them the most.

 

It's not bad if you take main battery mod 2 or grease the gears.

After all, Kansas isn't a sniper. She is a shotgun...again, like New Mexico.

[Admiral_Karasu]

It's been so long I don't actually remember if New Mexico was the one which was the absolute floating disaster if it was one of the better ones. What surprised me in the data provided by @pepe_trueno is the dispersion on NC, and IIRC, NC was a good ship with very good guns. How does Kansas compare with Colorado then, because I remember Colorado as having good guns but being otherwise rather a slow going sort of a bathtub.

[SoshiSone]

I don't play Kansas.  I play Mass with my Dorothy captain.  That way I can say "Dorothy, you're not in Kansas any more".

[Unlooky]

On 4/21/2024 at 5:28 AM, Admiral_Karasu said:

It's been so long I don't actually remember if New Mexico was the one which was the absolute floating disaster if it was one of the better ones. What surprised me in the data provided by @pepe_trueno is the dispersion on NC, and IIRC, NC was a good ship with very good guns. How does Kansas compare with Colorado then, because I remember Colorado as having good guns but being otherwise rather a slow going sort of a bathtub.

Colorado is significantly better than Kansas tier for tier. Her guns have excellent base accuracy values (2.0 sigma) to make up for not having accuracy mod, and a fairly average rate of fire. Since she's at T7, this means she's capable of overmatching nearly every equal and lower tier BB, easily doing 10k+ a salvo with proper aim. Meanwhile, Kansas has decidedly below average accuracy (1.7 sigma, no accuracy mod still) at a tier where she no longer overmatches BBs, with floaty shells and an abysmal reload. Tier 8 battleships are also now significantly outspeeding Kansas, instead of Colorado's below average but tolerable levels. 

[Justin_Simpleton]

21 minutes ago, Unlooky said:

Colorado is significantly better than Kansas tier for tier. Her guns have excellent base accuracy values (2.0 sigma) to make up for not having accuracy mod, and a fairly average rate of fire. Since she's at T7, this means she's capable of overmatching nearly every equal and lower tier BB, easily doing 10k+ a salvo with proper aim. Meanwhile, Kansas has decidedly below average accuracy (1.7 sigma, no accuracy mod still) at a tier where she no longer overmatches BBs, with floaty shells and an abysmal reload. Tier 8 battleships are also now significantly outspeeding Kansas, instead of Colorado's below average but tolerable levels. 

What you are saying here is true I suppose, but I think you misunderstand how to play slow BBs.  Speed is only a problem when running away.  Colorado is one of my comfort ships where I usually have a good game and Kansas gives a better game than NC regardless of tier standing.  Another comfort ship is Viribus Unitis which I play just like Kansas except I avoid planes.

[Unlooky]

Just now, Justin_Simpleton said:

What you are saying here is true I suppose, but I think you misunderstand how to play slow BBs.  Speed is only a problem when running away.  Colorado is one of my comfort ships where I usually have a good game and Kansas gives a better game than NC regardless of tier standing.  Another comfort ship is Viribus Unitis which I play just like Kansas except I avoid planes.

Lack of speed is a constant problem in BBs. More so than most classes I would say, they are extremely positional reliant to get broadsides, and thus, damage. Without speed, you can only pray your team will create crossfires for you. The lack of self sufficiency that every other BB has to varying extents is what makes her weak. It's especially painful for a ship like Kansas in which you cannot snipe, you cannot outtrade, and you cannot push/kite. Her successors are all capable of at least performing the first two. 

 

And considering I'm in the 2K PR range for Minnesota and Vermont, and 2.5K for Colorado, (and consider them all to be at minimum solidly above average ships) I really doubt it's a lack of understanding of slow BBs. Kansas is just a bad ship. 

[Justin_Simpleton]

2 minutes ago, Unlooky said:

Lack of speed is a constant problem in BBs. More so than most classes I would say, they are extremely positional reliant to get broadsides, and thus, damage. Without speed, you can only pray your team will create crossfires for you. The lack of self sufficiency that every other BB has to varying extents is what makes her weak. It's especially painful for a ship like Kansas in which you cannot snipe, you cannot outtrade, and you cannot push/kite. Her successors are all capable of at least performing the first two. 

I'm having no trouble landing salvos at full range and you can push at 1/4 speed.  There are plenty of guns on Kansas to severely wound or kill DDs and she can dodge torps pretty good if going full speed as well as taking the damage from some.  Kansas is also good for AA support and airstrikes.  Kansas doesn't fair well against most BBs in a dueling situation nor against fast subs.

 

14 minutes ago, Unlooky said:

And considering I'm in the 2K PR range for Minnesota and Vermont, and 2.5K for Colorado, (and consider them all to be at minimum solidly above average ships) I really doubt it's a lack of understanding of slow BBs. Kansas is just a bad ship. 

The point I was trying to make is that maybe this ship shouldn't be played in the same manner as other BBs thus there should be different expectations.  I keep thinking from the viewpoint of playing Randoms but no, I wouldn't choose this ship for any competitive games because she is too slow and too weak for that.