Andrewbassg Posted January 11 Share Posted January 11 (edited) So.... I had the dubious honour to play both against and also "with". And yes in ranked. Now, idk how effective is she in randoms, but in ranked......dear lord. Not necessarily the DMG output but the smoke....oh boy. A player with brains, laying down that smoke in select locations and in select circumstances...... is really really dented. Can very effectively mask the deployment of the team , of a battlegroup, or of a ship, or if necessary can jump in to help a losing situation. imagine laying that smoke and then go on to spot. Holy Molly...... Now I'm pretty much convinced that this "no Cv ranked, but Cv;s are still in"....is not a mistake. No way in hell that Wedgie would let this opportunity to go unexploited. Just as was the case with the infamous indestructible secondaries , when the KM BC's were released, they will claim some braindead "oh oopsie; sorry we did a mistake" sort of crap and let is as is,"just for a patch" just like then. Wedgie wants dollar and everybody and their mother will jump. Playing against this new line, with a good player in ranked......is almost a guaranteed loss. I don't believe for a second that Wedgie will rectify this. And if they don't.... their dishonesty will be laid bare. Edited January 11 by Andrewbassg 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoW_ Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 This is exactly why so many have left, or stopped playing randoms. It’s not fun or enjoyable to have little or no options to combat this junk. Add these squadrons are tactical squadrons that face no attrition….it’s disgusting. CV mains are happy so there’s that. Back to Ops I go. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel_Allan_Clark Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 1 hour ago, Andrewbassg said: imagine laying that smoke and then go on to spot. We don't have to imagine...we tested it, we gave feedback... 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel_Allan_Clark Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 28 minutes ago, DoW_ said: This is exactly why so many have left, or stopped playing randoms. It’s not fun or enjoyable to have little or no options to combat this junk. Add these squadrons are tactical squadrons that face no attrition….it’s disgusting. CV mains are happy so there’s that. Back to Ops I go. You think CV mains are happy? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kynami Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 Some of them without critical thinking might be. But I imagine quite a few of them are just a bit annoyed right now when the new line is basically the return of air superiority meta. And the only things that can really compete with that are running the exact same line, a select few premiums and specials, and USSR rocket assisted take-off. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfswetpaws Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 1 hour ago, Kynami said: Some of them without critical thinking might be. But I imagine quite a few of them are just a bit annoyed right now when the new line is basically the return of air superiority meta. And the only things that can really compete with that are running the exact same line, a select few premiums and specials, and USSR rocket assisted take-off. As somone who did play RTS CV's, I didn't mind the "air superiority" struggle. I felt it modeled what really happened or could happen, back in WW-II. I felt that RTS CV's were doing what CV's did. Launching aircraft and managing logistics and directing the squadrons (where to go, what targets to hit and etc.) while simultaneously moving the hull around. The planes could be shot-down, and weren't replenished. Losing the entire allotment of aircraft was a risk. The player was juggling a lot and some did it better than others. Then the CV re-work happened. Most of us know about that, so ... moving along. Then Hybrid BB's & Cruisers and even the Halford arrived in-game. With the possibility of certain Japanese Submarine designs joining the Hybrid club, someday. "Support" CV's were tested on the Public Test Server and on the live server, months ago. The mine-laying aircraft seem to be in storage, for now. But, the smoke-screen laying aircraft are here, now, in-game in a "final release" form (months after their initial testing). As a CV player, I can see there is an inconsistency between normal CV squadrons and the "tactical squadrons" which are very much like a "consumable" type of squadron used by Hybrid ships. Why don't these new CV's have the planes behave like normal squadrons? Using normal CV-relevant game mechanics? I admit, I don't know why WG/WOWs decided to make the special purpose "tactical squadrons" utilized by the newest CV's (instead of normally behaving squadrons). I'd like to know the *real* reasons and not just the published marketing hype (which doesn't seem convincing, to me). Every other type of CV that isn't a "support CV" utilzes planes which adhere to the "plane regeneration" mechanic. The details of the plane's characteristics may vary (hit-points, top-speed, turning radius and etc.), but they must launch, fly and be recovered (if not shot-down) or be regenerated (if shot-down). So, yeah. When combined with the upcoming changes to CV's (recently published in Dev-Blogs and WOWs news articles), I'm concerned and skeptical. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aethervox Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 (edited) 1 hour ago, Wolfswetpaws said: As somone who did play RTS CV's, I didn't mind the "air superiority" struggle. I felt it modeled what really happened or could happen, back in WW-II. I felt that RTS CV's were doing what CV's did. Launching aircraft and managing logistics and directing the squadrons (where to go, what targets to hit and etc.) while simultaneously moving the hull around. The planes could be shot-down, and weren't replenished. Losing the entire allotment of aircraft was a risk. The player was juggling a lot and some did it better than others. The good old days for CVs. If only the game would return to this, I'd give them some money again. Until then, my wallet is closed (& we haven't even mentioned 'Flubs' - a completely separate topic as to why WG no longer deserves being given money - then there's 'hybrids' - ditto). Edited January 12 by Aethervox 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crokodone Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 9 hours ago, Andrewbassg said: So.... I had the dubious honour to play both against and also "with". And yes in ranked. Now, idk how effective is she in randoms, but in ranked......dear lord. Not necessarily the DMG output but the smoke....oh boy. A player with brains, laying down that smoke in select locations and in select circumstances...... is really really dented. Can very effectively mask the deployment of the team , of a battlegroup, or of a ship, or if necessary can jump in to help a losing situation. imagine laying that smoke and then go on to spot. Holy Molly...... So competitive play intimidates you in a competitive mode? It should. If more ships had radar, smoke wouldn't be as much of a problem; especially when Most BBs have 14-16km smoke firing penalties. I guess you don't play randoms anymore and were in ranked to escape Submarines. Although it's rare, people still chain smoke with their DDs. Should WG put every single consumable on a shared use so it can't be used not than once? Even Randoms have to be competitive. 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrewbassg Posted January 12 Author Share Posted January 12 (edited) 8 hours ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said: We don't have to imagine...we tested it, we gave feedback... Wasn't interested in the testing process. Mines? Go south Wedgie.... But I always thought about smoke as being a simple curtain, like IRL photos suggested. I'm curious, it was like this during testing too? Coz the smoke is not actually a screen, It is as wide as the fattest bum in the game and can create safe passageways for entire battle groups, to get close to caps, buffs and whatnot. And this is just as a big lunacy as subs are. it is downright asinine to even assume that this won't break the game. Edited January 12 by Andrewbassg 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crokodone Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 5 hours ago, Wolfswetpaws said: somone who did play RTS CV's, I didn't mind the "air superiority" struggle. I felt it modeled what really happened or could happen, back in WW-II. I felt that RTS CV's were doing what CV's did. Launching aircraft and managing logistics and directing the squadrons (where to go, what targets to hit and etc.) while simultaneously moving the hull around. The planes could be shot-down, and weren't replenished. Losing the entire allotment of aircraft was a risk. The player was juggling a lot and some did it better than others. What RTS CVs did right and rework CVs did wrong, was preparation times. Squadrons are instantly available upon loading in for rework CVs. RTS CVs always had to prepare their squadrons before use; giving fleets time to deploy before the potential "hide and seek." Given WG's resort to tactical squadrons is probably a bandaid resort to reintroducing preparation times for these aircraft. If support CVs were laying smokes at the start of the battle, there'd be a point; but it's during the battle where that stuff normally occurs. I've seen Yorktown and Essex against normal CVs in randoms; the former almost always loses to the later team wise. Given how large the battle zone is in Random battles, that smoke Andrewbassg complains about isn't that effective. Personally I would have preferred mines. Since mines accelerated players going to the next battle,which is exactly what Victor Kingsley wants; he apparently doesn't want WoWs to be turned into a yacht club with models. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrewbassg Posted January 12 Author Share Posted January 12 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Crokodone said: So competitive play intimidates you in a competitive mode? Lolz....what is competitive in a mechanic giving a whole team an arguably decisive advantage? Like ....howz that even a suggestion? Just..... lolz.. 30 minutes ago, Crokodone said: especially when Most BBs have 14-16km smoke firing penalties. Ah you think that we talk about an area? And.... babbies should just stay in da smoke? Lolz.... But....still, FYI I melted a Zieten to half of his health, with my Mainz, from that smoke, while he could do absolutely nothing against me. The poor thing even ran away from that cap after that ...... 30 minutes ago, Crokodone said: and were in ranked to escape Submarines U mean..... past rankeds? Well newsflash mate, subs were introduced (supposedly tested) in , ya know....ranked. So there you go. And past ranked was with subs. So again, there you go. Look, I understand and to a degree respect that you are willing to go to "great lengths" to "defend", but Wedgie is not a damsell in distress and I would suggest to find another hill to.......defend. Coz dis ain't worth it and wont cut it. Edited January 12 by Andrewbassg 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crokodone Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 (edited) 4 hours ago, Andrewbassg said: Look, I understand and to a degree respect that you are willing to go to "great lengths" to "defend", but Wedgie is not a damsell in distress and I would suggest to find another hill to.......defend. Coz dis ain't worth it and wont cut it. ...I would suggest an update on those reading comprehension skills of yours. May I suggest reading more than once to avoid dubious embarrassments. The fact you hadn't figured that smoke firing penalties applied inside or out of the screen. But if you wanna dig tough guy... Start digging; my guns are loaded and I'm not running out of ammunition anytime soon. Be they CVs, Submarines, Radar or torpedoes. P.S Keep up with the emojis, they really show how soft the ground your position stands. Edited January 12 by Crokodone 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrewbassg Posted January 12 Author Share Posted January 12 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Crokodone said: ...I would suggest an update on those reading comprehension skills of yours. May I suggest reading more than once to avoid dubious embarrassments. Says the one who inferred babbies firing from smoke..... I'm curious what imaginary friend told you dat?? Coz me ain't.... Edited January 12 by Andrewbassg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crokodone Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 4 minutes ago, Andrewbassg said: Says the one who inferred babbies firing from smoke..... I'm curious what imaginary friend told you dat?? Coz me ain't.... The same imaginary friends that told you "babies" were in any of my statements: keep trolling; or come up with something news since 2015. Because I can't find it. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xamdam Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrewbassg Posted January 12 Author Share Posted January 12 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Crokodone said: The same imaginary friends that told you "babies" were in any of my statements: Oh...and wazz dis? 1 hour ago, Crokodone said: smoke wouldn't be as much of a problem; especially when Most BBs have 14-16km smoke firing penalties. Mentioning smoke firing penalties, when nobody said nor suggested that babbies should or could fire their guns from smoke, indicates that you are the one who think about this as being a problem. Yoo.... reading comprehension (coz thats what you've said) goes beyond what one sees in front of his eyes. Coz... ya know... we are not parrots. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reading_comprehension Just in case that, you somehow fail at the aforemnentioned matter, I;ve talked about deployment. Yeah, there you go. Edited January 12 by Andrewbassg 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel_Allan_Clark Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 3 hours ago, Andrewbassg said: Wasn't interested in the testing process. Mines? Go south Wedgie.... But I always thought about smoke as being a simple curtain, like IRL photos suggested. I'm curious, it was like this during testing too? Coz the smoke is not actually a screen, It is as wide as the fattest bum in the game and can create safe passageways for entire battle groups, to get close to caps, buffs and whatnot. And this is just as a big lunacy as subs are. it is downright asinine to even assume that this won't break the game. The smoke is not materially changed from the testing smoke. 2 hours ago, Crokodone said: What RTS CVs did right and rework CVs did wrong, was preparation times. Squadrons are instantly available upon loading in for rework CVs. RTS CVs always had to prepare their squadrons before use; giving fleets time to deploy before the potential "hide and seek." Given WG's resort to tactical squadrons is probably a bandaid resort to reintroducing preparation times for these aircraft. If support CVs were laying smokes at the start of the battle, there'd be a point; but it's during the battle where that stuff normally occurs. I've seen Yorktown and Essex against normal CVs in randoms; the former almost always loses to the later team wise. Given how large the battle zone is in Random battles, that smoke Andrewbassg complains about isn't that effective. Personally I would have preferred mines. Since mines accelerated players going to the next battle,which is exactly what Victor Kingsley wants; he apparently doesn't want WoWs to be turned into a yacht club with models. FYI, the tactical squadrons are immediately available to the CV. There is no immediate prep time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verytis Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 Smokescreens have always been strong, and sees use in CB as well. Although they're not without a few weaknesses. Large caliber ships like large CAs can't use smoke except from long distance due to smoke penalties. A great thing for smaller caliber ships, which don't see as much play. Static smokescreens don't handle well if the enemy repositions quickly. A blob of ships pushing down can force you out of the screen. Alternatively they all retreat, pulling out of your effective range. Or just ducking behind an island. You need a spotter to provide constant spotting for the full duration of the smoke. You need another ship nearby or... The CV must either refrain from attacking to spot with his squadrons or... The CV drop fighters. Although fighters aren't effective at keeping cruisers spotted, and are vulnerable to being baited by BB ASW. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HogHammer Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 Everyone gets it! Please, enough chest-pounding guys! Make your point and move on... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crokodone Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 (edited) 3 hours ago, Andrewbassg said: Oh...and wazz dis? Mentioning smoke firing penalties, when nobody said nor suggested that babbies should or could fire their guns from smoke, indicates that you are the one who think about this as being a problem. Someone hasn't taken their >something they need to be adults< this morning; should we call the doctor or the authorities? Because lying isn't winning an argument; even if it's a good start for a campaign trail. Which is what I find all your rant is 3 hours ago, Andrewbassg said: Yoo.... reading comprehension (coz thats what you've said) goes beyond what one sees in front of his eyes. Coz... ya know... we are not parrots. I remember when CNN was considered credible. I apologize for taking you as a credible player. 3 hours ago, Andrewbassg said: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reading_comprehension Just in case that, you somehow fail at the aforemnentioned matter, I;ve talked about deployment. Yeah, there you go. Did you even click that link??? Know what I'll be generous and give you an insert from an actual source just in case your... Clicker is broken: Your welcome... P.s editing a statement and pretending it's true for the whole community to see is called: slander; it's the nadir of lying and the grave of credibility. You don't even have your face on your profile and you can't tell the truth..: Next! Edited January 12 by Crokodone 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crokodone Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 1 hour ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said: The smoke is not materially changed from the testing smoke. FYI, the tactical squadrons are immediately available to the CV. There is no immediate prep time. That's peculiar because Kearsarge has a prep time, interesting to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfswetpaws Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 3 hours ago, Crokodone said: to be turned into a yacht club with models. Awww. What's wrong with "Yacht Club"? 😉 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crokodone Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said: Awww. What's wrong with "Yacht Club"? 😉 Because steaming around in circles like a sailing Regatta during high intensity battles is one of the factors that lead to the official forums being shut down. The Yacht Club side of WoWs is in the training rooms, where up to 24 members can geolocate their Marina wherever they wish... And engage in more civil, and sportsman like pastimes without ever having to face the threat of actually sinking their boat, or getting sued three times for a collision: Master, Vessel and Estate. Edited January 12 by Crokodone 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfswetpaws Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 8 minutes ago, Crokodone said: 1 hour ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said: The smoke is not materially changed from the testing smoke. FYI, the tactical squadrons are immediately available to the CV. There is no immediate prep time. That's peculiar because Kearsarge has a prep time, interesting to know. Hybrid ships have a "cooldown" timer,which prevents them from launching planes at the start of a battle. They have to wait for the planes to be ready. Normal CV squadrons can be launched immediately at the start of a battle. I admit I've not playtested a current Support CV, and don't have firsthand experience with the "tactical squadrons", yet. My previous playtesting of the Support CV's is from months ago. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel_Allan_Clark Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 3 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said: Hybrid ships have a "cooldown" timer,which prevents them from launching planes at the start of a battle. They have to wait for the planes to be ready. Normal CV squadrons can be launched immediately at the start of a battle. I admit I've not playtested a current Support CV, and don't have firsthand experience with the "tactical squadrons", yet. My previous playtesting of the Support CV's is from months ago. Support CV tactical squadrons start already available...after use, the cool down starts. They are not the same as the hybrids. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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