Lets change the song! :)

[Andrewbassg]

We had an initiative of good players to provide teaching and preaching. Lets move this to the practical realm, namely I put up two replays (for the moment) and I invite people to dissect them 🙂. I'm not proud of 'em , but also don't feel shame for them .

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1hN5XrhfRRsgWU3Ug2PRUkKX2PvCgMg4c/view?usp=drive_link

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1B5fBc-S7t0DK-peOtKFpvhUYqjPbG79M/view?usp=drive_link

The first is a loss (and ends prematurely 😞 ) the second is a win.

 

Don't hold back 🙂 

Edit : I HAVE to include this one too  🙂

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1JA8s29Tl0LpMZI9uhMAyXebPONYceRmn/view?usp=drive_link 

2000 BxP, 130k  game 🙂  have it all, unconventional tactics, bad positioning/disposition,  runaway reds, babbies who chase dd's. open water gunboating in a Sejong 🙂  and an end which was in limbo until the very end 🙂 

Also highlights  HOW much Sejong is a team dependent ship.  :)

PS All battles were played consecutively. 

 

Edited October 31, 2023 by Andrewbassg

[BOBTHEBALL]

I'll look at these as soon as I can, just a bit busy atm. 

[Unlooky]

I do not have access to any of these files. Can you enable sharing via link? 

Just now, Andrewbassg said:

We had an initiative of good players to provide teaching and preaching. Lets move this to the practical realm, namely I put up two replays (for the moment) and I invite people to dissect them 🙂. I'm not proud of 'em , but also don't feel shame for them .

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1hN5XrhfRRsgWU3Ug2PRUkKX2PvCgMg4c/view?usp=drive_link

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1B5fBc-S7t0DK-peOtKFpvhUYqjPbG79M/view?usp=drive_link

The first is a loss (and ends prematurely 😞 ) the second is a win.

 

Don't hold back 🙂 

Edit : I HAVE to include this one too  🙂

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1JA8s29Tl0LpMZI9uhMAyXebPONYceRmn/view?usp=drive_link 

2000 BxP, 130k  game 🙂  have it all, unconventional tactics, bad positioning/disposition,  runaway reds, babbies who chase dd's. open water gunboating in a Sejong 🙂  and an end which was in limbo until the very end 🙂 

Also highlights  HOW much Sejong is a team dependent ship.  :)

PS All battles were played consecutively. 

 

 

[Andrewbassg]

9 minutes ago, Unlooky said:

I do not have access to any of these files. Can you enable sharing via link? 

Ah my bad pls try it now...

[Unlooky]

Replay 1 (Sejong, North)

1. I don't have your exact build, but it seems very suspect to say the least. You have RPF, but neither concealment nor superintendent. Imo RPF is rather redundant on the JInan line since you don't have the burst damage, concealment, or utility to go destroyer hunting. It's not worth taking over the massively important Concealment Expert or also important superintendent. I recommend respeccing as soon as the patch comes out with free resets. Lastly, you have rangemod, which is not recommended especially for ranked. Your shell travel time will be so long that hitting anything other than stationary battleships is virtually impossible. Reload mod is far superior for the Jinan line.
2. Your first smoke, in my opinion, is premature. Yes the kronshtadt is spotted, but he can still disengage from you, and you will have wasted a smoke. Since you also were the one spotting, this means that there is no guarantee he will stay lit. Luckily for you, other ships appeared, but you still prevented yourself from having vision on them. 
3. Good area denial torps, but I personally would have aimed them more right since players will typically inch up along the island chain (if they go there at all). 
4. When you left the cap, you should have used TRB to dump more torps down the channel. 
5. Turning back in is a mistake. The Buffalo and Kronshtadt are almost certainly within radar range, so your smoke will not save you. The correct play is to kite further out. 
6. You could see from the minimap and the fact that you were not getting any hits that the Rupprecht was turning in. No point in wasting shots trying to hit him then. The Iowa is a target that is actually hittable. 
7. Aimed much too high on the salvos fired at the Iowa. He is bow on to you and going forward. Aim low. 
8. Smoking, and continuing to reverse in front of the rupprecht was a COLOSSAL MISTAKE. You were lucky that all his shots overpenned. You KNEW his hydro was on: any torpedoes fired would be easily dodged, whitelining them makes no sense there. As it was, you lost half your HP just to land 7 penetrations. If the Rupprecht player was luckier/aimed better, then you get devstruck there, end of story. Use the island as cover to run away with your FDG. 
9. At this point you were much too far out of position and nothing could have saved you. 

It seems you were far too committed to trying to hold the flank, even against 2 radar cruisers and a hydro BB. Know when to disengage. You have a battleship who lost all his HP 2 minutes in and yourself. Run away, use your smoke to safely farm far away from the radars and BBs, but throwing your ship away just to hold a point for a few seconds longer is never worth it. Once you turned back in, it only was a matter of time before you died. 

[Unlooky]

Replay 2: Sejong, Neighbors

1. The build and it's issues remain the same. 
2. This may be a replay glitch, but are you using the Q and E keys to manipulate your rudder? It's much too clunky for evasive maneuvers personally, using A and D is far more precise.
3. 2 minutes into the game, and you are dangerously broadside to their entire BB force. I know you have priority target, but this is not a wise maneuver. Jean Bart is fully within his rights to devstrike you right then and there. 
4. You honestly should be reversing in your smoke. Even with your rangemod build you are barely reaching the closest Pommern. Make life a bit easier for you and get closer. This also makes it much easier for you to hit shots on the enemy DD, if it were to be spotted. 
5. You take two blind shots here on people behind islands. Don't do this unless your camera can peer over the island. It will target the terrain you are looking at instead. When blindfiring look at the minimap to confirm that your aiming point (designated by the circle) actually lines up on the enemy icon.
   1. This shot is not going to land anywhere near the Pommern. If you are shooting over an island, always confirm that your aimpoint is where you actually want it to be, and not some random patch of water between you and him.                                                                                          
6. Good target selection in focusing down the Donskoi.
7. After the Donskoi is dead, you are 16km away from your targets in a Sejong. Your ballistics, are simply put, abysmal. 
8. Firing at the Jean Bart is a mistake. Looking at the map, you know that the Kitakaze is almost certainly going to spot you. As soon as you were spotted, you should have immediately stopped firing and angled to present the most difficult target to hit. Staying alive is the goal here, not getting 10k extra damage.
9. When in binocular view, you can still hold right click to enter free lock mode and see the torpedoes. Speeding up was also unnecessary, throwing it into full reverse would probably have been sufficient to dodge those torpedoes even if they didn't run out of range.

 

Your impact on this match was negligible at best. You helped kill the donskoi, which was good, but after that you did minimal chip damage to both the Jutland and battleships. Leading the Sejong shells is difficult and you running range mod (and staying at max range) doesn't help with that either. In this game, I would have just followed the Black and started kiting the battleships. With three battleships on your side, you should have been able to do more than 50k damage. Change your build to Concealment Expert and Reload Mod to allow you to get closer and do more damage. That isn't to say full commit bow in the way you did the first game, but begin the engagement closer and kite to the limit of your range. It will also allow you to use your torpedoes more often. 

[Andrewbassg]

1. 🙂 you are right, it is a bit. Sa Zhenbing is in training and this Santa was the 21 pointer a bit optimised for Asym battles

 i value greatly RPF you will see its utility in the third battle. As for the reload.....it would give a 0.4 reduction which is quite marginal for 4 points . But a LOT of incoming HE shells from a distance have quite a deterrent effect 🙂 Like in the third battle .

2. it wasn't for me. The FDG was late and i tried to conceal him from focus fire.

3. I waited too long to launch them. Should have been sooner and less firing. Kinda wanted to help the FDG to share the incoming fire.

4. It was clear that they were coming the other way. And I wanted to preserve then for later use.

5. Yes but holding the cap I deemed important to buy time

6. 7.True. tho i tried to deter.

8. Yes. 🙂  Still it was clear that I won't get far, so I tried to bring him with me. Unsuccessfully.

40 minutes ago, Unlooky said:

Once you turned back in, it only was a matter of time before you died.

Pretty much.

To be clear 'im not "explaining" ,i'm telling what I was thinking.

[Andrewbassg]

2. it is a glitch. i'm using custom keymapping with the arrows and  numpads for  everything so everything is one hand 🙂 

Arrows for Nav, 1,2,3 for artillery and torps. 4.5 map; 6 aistrike, 7,8,9,Pg Dwn/Up consumables, 0 lock on,Numpad del for turret/torp change. / for sec/AA on off, and * for sector.

3.  🙂  i play with rudder shift. Kinda like to bully babbies to fire at me 🙂 

4. True. It was s about deterrence.

5. Good point.

7,8.9 and conclusion all true and valid. Honestly i ended up waay to far from the action.

[MidnightPhoenix07]

8 hours ago, Andrewbassg said:

As for the reload.....it would give a 0.4 reduction which is quite marginal for 4 points . But a LOT of incoming HE shells from a distance have quite a deterrent effect 🙂

Yes a solid line of shells has a psychological effect (just look at Minotaur or release Smolensk), but I also agree with Unlooky’s point. All the extra range will get you is an extra 2 km to farm stationary battleships. The ballistics are way too floaty for it to actually be effective range. You’re not going to hit anything that isn’t standing still or moving in a straight line.

On the other hand, faster reload will help burn closer battleships down quicker, and even more importantly killing spotted destroyers to support your team’s DDs. You can provide AA cover for allies, but your primary team support role is helping to kill enemy DDs and wear down larger targets with DOT. If you’re not going all in on torps, main battery reload is by far a better choice over range.

In randoms, maybe range could work since high tier battleships like to sit back. But not for ranked. And if the battleships are too far away to hit in randoms, either move to a closer island or set a closer smokescreen if you can do so safely. 

 

As for other skills, not having SI or SE is concerning. With such a small health pool, you want the extra health one or both provide. And with SI, an extra “island on demand” smokescreen to cover an ally or farm from. I’m fine with RL, but I’d swap something for one of the two health-boosting skills, especially for ranked and probably randoms too. 

[Andrewbassg]

56 minutes ago, MidnightPhoenix07 said:

Yes a solid line of shells has a psychological effect (just look at Minotaur or release Smolensk), but I also agree with Unlooky’s point. All the extra range will get you is an extra 2 km to farm stationary battleships. The ballistics are way too floaty for it to actually be effective range. You’re not going to hit anything that isn’t standing still or moving in a straight line.

On the other hand, faster reload will help burn closer battleships down quicker, and even more importantly killing spotted destroyers to support your team’s DDs. You can provide AA cover for allies, but your primary team support role is helping to kill enemy DDs and wear down larger targets with DOT. If you’re not going all in on torps, main battery reload is by far a better choice over range.

In randoms, maybe range could work since high tier battleships like to sit back. But not for ranked. And if the battleships are too far away to hit in randoms, either move to a closer island or set a closer smokescreen if you can do so safely. 

 

As for other skills, not having SI or SE is concerning. With such a small health pool, you want the extra health one or both provide. And with SI, an extra “island on demand” smokescreen to cover an ally or farm from. I’m fine with RL, but I’d swap something for one of the two health-boosting skills, especially for ranked and probably randoms too. 

These are all very good points.

Like I said in the first response, it is a strange build 🙂,  optimised for Asym battles and I kinda stuck with it . I found that this build was best for it and Sejong one of the few cruisers that could work, generally. That was the moment when i started to play the line, until then i wasn't a fan 🙂.

As for randoms ... no, range  wouldn't work. One would need to swap  rudder shift for concealment, a specialised torpedo build and adopt an opportunistic playstyle.  Which is not my cup of tea 🙂.

However in ranked, i can make this build  work.  indeed it is  not the best, nor is the ship for the mode ( tho is a formidable defender).  it is a ...... compromise .

[Frostbow]

Range mod in Sejong or Jinan can be made to work, but it can feel like starting a guitar solo on Ab.

LOL

[Andrewbassg]

Continuing providing material for critique and leaning 🙂. 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1blqh_ZyoD0ZdRpCLnOCWeKdMpgw0S5Nq/view?usp=drive_link

This is a textbook example on what both a Sejong and a Jaeger can do, in terms of denying a cap. Jaeger is not a good cap contester (which is kinda generally true for all smokeless dd's) but can be a formidable cap denier.

P.s. I know, Free look exist, but since the camera rework  the game induces enough dizziness as is 😞 

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1XTyxuqI8ajbGDIfjYmS0dzK9Vcf0j608/view?usp=drive_link

This battle features an "unconventional" approach/positioning  from my part. Personally, I fault the Musa for not sinking the Georgia, thus not keeping me alive and in effect, losing the battle . That was a rookie mistake.

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1NiD2kYWfxNDxw_n2ot9Us13CxBJCrPKP/view?usp=drive_link

This loss .....well I let you spot my mistake 🙂 And of the others.

Edit: Btw anyone can jump in, the purpose is to  discuss and in extension, to teach. Me not being Flamu or other "purple" player 🙂 it  can help others in the same shoes as me.

Edited November 2, 2023 by Andrewbassg