Goodbye to all that--Confessions of a random outlier

[Stauffenberg44]

I'm not putting this up to whine or rage about random and MM (we all do that and often daily); but I thought my recent shift (finally) away from random play might interest people, and I'm also curious if others have crossed this threshold to better enjoy this compellingly complex and nuanced game.

Most of my 11.5k battles were played between 2016 and 2021. I was a historical collector of ships first and foremost, not terribly concerned with  WR percentages. Of course my WR suffered accordingly as I flipped around in some 90 select ships with captains, randomly playing them whether I was good, bad or indifferent on any particular ship. I basically shrugged at the frequent losing streaks ("Do not go gentle into your random fate, rage rage against your plunging win rate" to grossly paraphrase the famous poem by Dylan Thomas). I carried on almost exclusively in random assuming I could advance up the tech trees and get what I wanted quicker; that and the fact that I didn't fancy beating up bots. This time around I have focused on ships I had a decent WR on in my earlier incarnation here and sold the rest, using the new captain skills dynamic to generate 8 new 21-pt captains.

Having played for a few months and hearing from a grognard on here with 45k battles played almost exclusively in Coop, and able to get everything he wanted out of the game, I began to change my tune and consider leaving random. Why? Again, no whining--it is what it is--but it seems far more toxic and stressed than in earlier days; certainly nowhere near as bad as it was in WoT (which I thankfully left ages ago), but enough to find me moving most of my play into brawls and operations. I'll still play randoms of course, though mostly with the ten submarines that I now have. Speaking of them, playing subs is definitely an experience I have to say. Not only the steep learning curve (operating in 3-dimensional space as opposed to basically 2-D), I find myself frequently shelled and rammed by friendlies. Reminds me of the early days with CV's excoriated as "sky cancer" etc. I get that and can certainly live with it, but I have to say it's a breath of fresh air mostly leaving random with its inevitable win rate manias, thinking and feeling now as Robert Graves once put it after leaving his own war in the trenches: "goodbye to all that."

Anyone else gone through this sort of shift, and why, or why not?

Cheers.

[Wowzery]

I left random about 2020 or so.  I had noticed more and more allies hiding behind islands for extended periods of play.  The final straw was back to back games of my team hiding behind one island.  Nothing like seeing 10 allies all behind the same island.

I play occasionally but still haven't found the fun of those early years.

[Capt_Kremenski]

I've played 20K battles in COOP and 100 in random!

Yes my WR in random is shite, yes I'm not very good, but...

I like sailing my ships and killing shit, an easy battle or 10 after a crappy day is just what the doctor ordered!

I don't need a load of whiney turds shouting and screaming in chat as if they're gods gift to the seven seas. (Yes, I know I can disable chat).

I just like to have a beer and blow stuff up! Can't wait till asym comes back (next patch I think).

Horses for courses!

[Type_93]

As long as you are still having fun playing, do what you do boo boo!

Some of us enjoy being try hards and working on improving our play, but hold no contempt for those of you who prefer pve. Hell, some of the best people here are pve mains and I hold nothing but love for them. It’s all about the fun. 
 

 

[Sumseaman]

4 hours ago, Stauffenberg44 said:

Anyone else gone through this sort of shift, and why, or why not?

What a refreshing perspective.

Personally I have begun to play Operations more frequently, mainly due to the fact that it is now possible to grind to X cost effectively without the guilt and lack of consideration in bringing a sub par ship into a competitive mode. It also gives a great opportunity to familiarise oneself with a new ship. I congratulate you on such a mature and productive attitude.

Extra likes for embracing subs. The type, no matter what some might say, takes significant skill and doesn't diverge from normal 'play', as some would call it, as CVs do.

[Wolfswetpaws]

4 hours ago, Stauffenberg44 said:

I'm not putting this up to whine or rage about random and MM (we all do that and often daily); but I thought my recent shift (finally) away from random play might interest people, and I'm also curious if others have crossed this threshold to better enjoy this compellingly complex and nuanced game.

Most of my 11.5k battles were played between 2016 and 2021. I was a historical collector of ships first and foremost, not terribly concerned with  WR percentages. Of course my WR suffered accordingly as I flipped around in some 90 select ships with captains, randomly playing them whether I was good, bad or indifferent on any particular ship. I basically shrugged at the frequent losing streaks ("Do not go gentle into your random fate, rage rage against your plunging win rate" to grossly paraphrase the famous poem by Dylan Thomas). I carried on almost exclusively in random assuming I could advance up the tech trees and get what I wanted quicker; that and the fact that I didn't fancy beating up bots. This time around I have focused on ships I had a decent WR on in my earlier incarnation here and sold the rest, using the new captain skills dynamic to generate 8 new 21-pt captains.

Having played for a few months and hearing from a grognard on here with 45k battles played almost exclusively in Coop, and able to get everything he wanted out of the game, I began to change my tune and consider leaving random. Why? Again, no whining--it is what it is--but it seems far more toxic and stressed than in earlier days; certainly nowhere near as bad as it was in WoT (which I thankfully left ages ago), but enough to find me moving most of my play into brawls and operations. I'll still play randoms of course, though mostly with the ten submarines that I now have. Speaking of them, playing subs is definitely an experience I have to say. Not only the steep learning curve (operating in 3-dimensional space as opposed to basically 2-D), I find myself frequently shelled and rammed by friendlies. Reminds me of the early days with CV's excoriated as "sky cancer" etc. I get that and can certainly live with it, but I have to say it's a breath of fresh air mostly leaving random with its inevitable win rate manias, thinking and feeling now as Robert Graves once put it after leaving his own war in the trenches: "goodbye to all that."

Anyone else gone through this sort of shift, and why, or why not?

Cheers.

As I was beginning my World of Warships player "career", I mostly sailed into Co-op games.
Because I felt that I still had a lot to learn, in order to be effective in random battles.

Over the course of time, I improved my abilities and ventured into randoms and ranked and brawls and scenario operations and temporary event battle modes.
Sometimes I was victorious, sometimes not.
Either way, I gained experience and continued to learn new tricks and hone my existing repertoire.

Now?
I still play more Co-op than randoms.  Co-op is a more "chill & relaxed" environment. 
It is also efficient for the pursuit of my goals on numerous occasions.
That said, if I feel that a random battle is more appropriate (when I'm playing a Submarine, for example), then I'm willing to sail into random battles.
Some in-game missions require playing in random battles or ranked.
Simply put, there are times when a player will be faced with a choice of doing what is necessary to gain the offered rewards, or not.

Long story short?
I play all available ship types and all available game modes (at least once, for testing & evaluation purposes).
Each has its virtues, vices and quirks.
Sail whatever ship you want into whichever game mode you want.  You're the player and it's your decision.  🙂 
 

[Stauffenberg44]

1 hour ago, Sumseaman said:

What a refreshing perspective.

Personally I have begun to play Operations more frequently, mainly due to the fact that it is now possible to grind to X cost effectively without the guilt and lack of consideration in bringing a sub par ship into a competitive mode. It also gives a great opportunity to familiarise oneself with a new ship. I congratulate you on such a mature and productive attitude.

Extra likes for embracing subs. The type, no matter what some might say, takes significant skill and doesn't diverge from normal 'play', as some would call it, as CVs do.

Same to you,🎇

I suppose it was blatant clickbait posting this as a mock "I'm leaving!" rant we've all read so often. Like you I intend to selectively use random (along with everything else), but I have greatly diminished appearing in it. One main prompt to do that as you noted, was in realizing that Operations can "make sense" cost and effectiveness wise. I was one of the early commentators on the early forum to repeated opine "what they really need are missions escorting convoys" etc. Upon returning, lo, it's happened. I'm quite enjoying that.

And subs are a riot, full of the agony and the ecstasy. I even rammed a DD last week with the I-56 and survived, thanks to the large hit point pool (24,200) and a ramming flag. It makes me wonder about in-game piloted kaiten torps, but I suppose that's just too... you supply the word. If some people hate subs now one can imagine their reception to kaitens appearing.

Cheers.

[Stauffenberg44]

1 hour ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

Now?
I still play more Co-op than randoms.  Co-op is a more "chill & relaxed" environment. 
It is also efficient for the pursuit of my goals on numerous occasions.
That said, if I feel that a random battle is more appropriate (when I'm playing a Submarine, for example), then I'm willing to sail into random battles.
Some in-game missions require playing in random battles or ranked.
Simply put, there are times when a player will be faced with a choice of doing what is necessary to gain the offered rewards, or not.

Yep. yep, yep, yes and yes. Very well stated. Couldn't agree more. "Chill & relaxed"  is my motto this time around.

Cheers.

[Stauffenberg44]

5 hours ago, Type_93 said:

Hell, some of the best people here are pve mains and I hold nothing but love for them. It’s all about the fun. 

Yes that pretty much sums it up doesn't it? Thanks. 👍

[Latouche_Treville]

I stopped randoms in 2019 . I was not good, didn't want to be the weak link of the team, and getting good would ask me too much time (don't need another job).

[Bumblegoose]

I tend to play about 10 Co-op games to every 1 Random game. Co-op is generally a friendlier and more relaxing environment. It probably suits me as an older player with neurological problems.

Co-op enables you to play a wide range of ships and tiers. Ships which are objectively weak in randoms are usually good enough and interesting to play in Co-op. You can challenge yourself in Co-op to progressively improve your stats with a particular ship. While still having fun.

I have a patient positional defensive style of play which is probably well-suited to Randoms. I tend to do well in lower tier randoms. Nothing special. My conservative style probably bores friend and foe alike.

However, having good survivability in Randoms merely increases my suffering in this mode. I get to witness the suicide of my team-mates, one by one, or sometimes en masse like lemmings. Human players can be way more creative and effective in plotting their own demise than mere bots. Then I get to participate in a back-to-the -wall desperate fightback to seek to rescue my team from the jaws of defeat. Occasionally, I pull off a fightback win that my teammates in no way deserved. That's where I got my 33 solo warrior achievements from. But really, it was a lot of stress and no fun at all. Too much heavy lifting.

Edited November 14 by Bumblegoose
clarification

[Leo_Apollo11]

HI all,

  

10 hours ago, Stauffenberg44 said:

I'm not putting this up to whine or rage about random and MM (we all do that and often daily); but I thought my recent shift (finally) away from random play might interest people, and I'm also curious if others have crossed this threshold to better enjoy this compellingly complex and nuanced game.

Most of my 11.5k battles were played between 2016 and 2021. I was a historical collector of ships first and foremost, not terribly concerned with  WR percentages. Of course my WR suffered accordingly as I flipped around in some 90 select ships with captains, randomly playing them whether I was good, bad or indifferent on any particular ship. I basically shrugged at the frequent losing streaks ("Do not go gentle into your random fate, rage rage against your plunging win rate" to grossly paraphrase the famous poem by Dylan Thomas). I carried on almost exclusively in random assuming I could advance up the tech trees and get what I wanted quicker; that and the fact that I didn't fancy beating up bots. This time around I have focused on ships I had a decent WR on in my earlier incarnation here and sold the rest, using the new captain skills dynamic to generate 8 new 21-pt captains.

Having played for a few months and hearing from a grognard on here with 45k battles played almost exclusively in Coop, and able to get everything he wanted out of the game, I began to change my tune and consider leaving random. Why? Again, no whining--it is what it is--but it seems far more toxic and stressed than in earlier days; certainly nowhere near as bad as it was in WoT (which I thankfully left ages ago), but enough to find me moving most of my play into brawls and operations. I'll still play randoms of course, though mostly with the ten submarines that I now have. Speaking of them, playing subs is definitely an experience I have to say. Not only the steep learning curve (operating in 3-dimensional space as opposed to basically 2-D), I find myself frequently shelled and rammed by friendlies. Reminds me of the early days with CV's excoriated as "sky cancer" etc. I get that and can certainly live with it, but I have to say it's a breath of fresh air mostly leaving random with its inevitable win rate manias, thinking and feeling now as Robert Graves once put it after leaving his own war in the trenches: "goodbye to all that."

Anyone else gone through this sort of shift, and why, or why not?

Cheers.

I play WoWs since Open BETA and I have just a shy below 8.500 Random battles played.

WinRate 56,29%.

 

I stopped playing Random battles in 2019.

Since then I played just a few Random battles:

• 2020 = 200 = 59% WinRate
• 2021 = 94 = 57% WinRate
• 2022 = 0
• 2023 = 13 (all by accident - you remember WoWs automatically switching battle types in error when in Brawl in October 2023) = 70% WinRate
• 2024 = 0

 

I still do play Ranked, Brawl, Asymmetrical battles, CoOp and special Battle types (like Borg invasion we have now).

 

I never looked back... 🙂

 

Leo "Apollo11"

[Admiral_Karasu]

I haven't completely abandoned randoms even yet, although every time WG screwed up the game for me I started playing less. I mean less overall, not just when it came to the randoms. Two notable 'downgrades' to me, in my personal opinion, were the captain skills rework and the introduction of the subs.

I still play randoms on low tiers, on tier 5, occasionally on other tiers and almost always when it comes to high tier DD's (tiers 9 to *) because, as incredible as it sounds, I perform less badly on them in randoms compared to the high tier operations where I usually get sunk within the first minute or so.

[Silence_CN]

Pleasure has faded away after time.
I mainly play Operations today, closed my wallet long ago and, even if I still sometimes play in random (less and less tbh), I do not even bother to mask the reality : I reached a point of saturation with the game.
I just play the ships I still find funny, whatever the tier, but I don't bother to achieve anything.

 

Anyway, and since I am deeply awaiting S.T.A.L.K.E.R. 2., as far as I am concerned, within 6 days, I'll be off the game for a while... an very long while.

[desmo_2]

Aside from the occasional complete jackwagon, I don't find Randoms to be that toxic.  Most games there is no childish behavior at all.  Sometimes a player will pop off one comment when he gets sunk and it goes no further.

Random games still appeal to me because I never know what the teams will look like and the outcome is unknown.  I do play plenty of Co-op games and enjoy those, but I primarily use Co-op for missions that can be completed more quickly using that mode.

15,461 Random games with 57% WR.

11,145 Co-op games with 99% WR.

473 Ranked games with 58% WR.

 

[Justin_Simpleton]

14 hours ago, Stauffenberg44 said:

-but it seems far more toxic and stressed than in earlier days;

I'm not experiencing this toxicity.  It may be because I rarely look at chat msgs since it's primarily nonsense spamming each other.  I just don't understand why I'm seeing any msgs from the enemy team when team communication is sorely needed in Randoms.

I try co-op from time to time but I really don't like bots especially in Random battles.  They cheat.  So, I play Randoms. I'm used to the pace of the battle which is slower than in co-op and switching between modes messes up my internal timers.  I'm having no trouble completing missions primarily with battleships.   

I play aggressively for a few minutes and then watch the remainder of the battle on the mini-map or from an ally's ship to see if my early demise tipped the balance of the game at the beginning such as when securing a flank.     

[Kruzenstern]

I stopped playing randoms more or less when operations were first introduced. Not because I was bad or they were toxic, but because the other players were so terrible, they made me toxic. I just have a hard time finding any kind of understanding for people not applying even the most basic common sense to their gameplay. It always irritates me. At least in ops there are only 5 other people a 2 man div needs to carry, that works almost all the time. Still a lot of rage-inducing idiocy, but not nearly as much as in randoms, and in ops terrible players can actually be beneficial as they allow me to do more damage. They just have to be good enough to not lose the op (sometimes they aren't).

I still do the occasional random nowadays when some combat mission or other is easier to do there than in ops or coop (like potential damage ones, or stuff involving CVs). But while still trying to win, my main objective is working towards the combat mission goal, so people stupidly tossing the match don't bother me nearly as much as they did in the past. Also wrecks my winrate, but that doesn't bother me anymore either.

[Andrewbassg]

14 hours ago, Stauffenberg44 said:

Anyone else gone through this sort of shift, and why, or why not?

Well, I don't really play randoms. Too cramped for my taste, OG randoms were 9v9 NOT 12v12 and it is crystal clear that maps and the game were designed with that in mind. Ranked, ops, occasional special modes ( tho, Wedgie is hellbent to destroy them for whatevs reason) pretty much covers my needs.

That being said, I do sometimes dive in, usually for missions or Naval Battle.

[Admiral_Karasu]

45 minutes ago, Andrewbassg said:

Well, I don't really play randoms. Too cramped for my taste, OG randoms were 9v9 NOT 12v12 and it is crystal clear that maps and the game were designed with that in mind. Ranked, ops, occasional special modes ( tho, Wedgie is hellbent to destroy them for whatevs reason) pretty much covers my needs.

That being said, I do sometimes dive in, usually for missions or Naval Battle.

I've often wondered about the maps and their size. Clearly, as for the maps we currently have in rotation, the lower tiers have much better maps to play on than the high tiers. Has anyone ever figured out the 'physical' size of these maps? In any case, the map sizes on the higher tiers are disproportionately small considering the greater speeds and ranges the ships have there.

Just a small side step, not wanting to derail the thread, as it were.

[Snargfargle]

9 minutes ago, Admiral_Karasu said:

I've often wondered about the maps and their size.

The Wiki lists the size in kilometers for each map.

https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Maps

 

[Andrewbassg]

21 minutes ago, Admiral_Karasu said:

I've often wondered about the maps and their size

 

6 minutes ago, Snargfargle said:

The Wiki lists the size in kilometers for each map.

https://wiki.wargaming.net/en/Ship:Maps

 

And if you press ALT in battle, will gave you the size and its name.

[Ensign Cthulhu]

16 hours ago, Stauffenberg44 said:

Anyone else gone through this sort of shift, and why, or why not?

I became a co-op main in 2018 after burning myself out on something called the Indianapolis Marathon and then compounding the burnout by sitting down to a diet of 300,000 CXP in one day to make my first 19 point commander. 

Fortunately, it was at this point that WG introduced Directives, more or less the combat missions we have now, and opened up eligibility for co-op to take part in all the major routine events. At once I was back in the game, in a stress-free environment with a high win rate and an easier - if somewhat longer - track to do pretty much everything that everyone else was doing. There was still SOME PVP-only stuff but almost all of this was campaigns, which I could do at leisure with no time restrictions and then put down again if I was feeling burned out (this was before they changed the XP and credits missions in the Yamamoto campaign to allow co-op). 

Oddly enough, I can't stand operations any more. I feel the stress and the weight of expectations far worse than I do in Randoms or even Ranked. I feel like the best Ops players were all siphoned off into voice-comms divs, the remainder don't have what it takes to complete most of the ops most of the time (e.g. failing Killer Whale because they're too busy farming to get back to the exit circle), and I don't dare risk boosters there any more. 

Asymmetric is worse still. People come in who hear that it's an easy farming mode and they fail and die, and the stress of trying to retrieve that situation is more than I need.

The Halloween modes are okay because (a) they're so far removed from normal WOWS and (b) you're fighting exclusively for yourself, and if I fail then it only rebounds on me and not my team-mates. 

From time to time I've gone back to Randoms whenever I've felt a burst of enthusiasm or had a mission that HAS to be done there, and to this day I will go there to throw on blue boosters and finish a grind when I'm near the end. But co-op is where it's at for me right now, and I don't see that changing any time soon. 

 

By the way, Stauffenberg, I take it you've read Graves's book? I did a re-read very recently. One thing he makes very clear at one point is that Siegfried Sassoon was an absolute badass - possibly the most hardcore of all the war poets, and one of the few prominent ones to actually survive the war.

Edited November 14 by Ensign Cthulhu

[palestreamer]

I don't mind randoms, but I find I just don't have time to play randoms any more. There is so much else to do. I go for the steel and dubs in ranked. I grind new ships in Ops, which also pays well. Now I am grinding for coal and steel in the Star Trek Mode. And I go for the credits in brawls. When assym is around I do that because it pays well without the stress of randoms. I usually just have time to do a handful of randoms on weekends to get stars for the clan.

[Asym]

1 hour ago, Admiral_Karasu said:

I've often wondered about the maps and their size. Clearly, as for the maps we currently have in rotation, the lower tiers have much better maps to play on than the high tiers. Has anyone ever figured out the 'physical' size of these maps? In any case, the map sizes on the higher tiers are disproportionately small considering the greater speeds and ranges the ships have there.

Just a small side step, not wanting to derail the thread, as it were.

It's funny, I brought that discussion thread up when Ops increased beyond tier 8 "without expanding map sizes" to accommodate the "weapons & sensor effectiveness" the newer ships would present.  Some of the * level ships weapons effectiveness exceeds the map sizes to the point, in some ops, the bots not only out number you, they are more combat effective.....  Even in Divisions of three to six, it depends on "what you select" just to survive.  If a division mate selects a slow firing and speed BB, the rest of the team can get screwed....  So..........???  Even we, whom division and win a lot get "turned around" by poor choices...

It's fun and frustrating.........but, it's implemented to drive faster matches with losses.  Remember, throughput is their goal.

35 minutes ago, Ensign Cthulhu said:

Oddly enough, I can't stand operations any more. I feel the stress and the weight of expectations far worse than I do in Randoms or even Ranked. I feel like the best Ops players were all siphoned off into voice-comms divs, the remainder don't have what it takes to complete most of the ops most of the time (e.g. failing Killer Whale because they're too busy farming to get back to the exit circle), and I don't dare risk boosters there any more.

Most nights we play in a multi clan Division "we've know each other for decades !" and, to be honest, we lose matches because major combatants whom are not part of the Division simply won't "play along and they die very quickly"

The "power creep" in the PVE "team modes" is to sell Superships and, frustrate PVE mains whom they hope will migrate to an even worse game modes:  PVP.  Take it or leave it is their mantra it seems.   These changes really weren't thought out.   They can be fun but........it takes a team to win most days.

Edited November 14 by Asym

[Wolfswetpaws]

9 hours ago, Latouche_Treville said:

I stopped randoms in 2019 . I was not good, didn't want to be the weak link of the team, and getting good would ask me too much time (don't need another job).

Normally a "job" pays you (for your efforts). 
I think WOWs is a fun game, which may turn into a "hobby".
With a hobby, a person pays for the hobby (to take classes and to purchase hobby equipment and "craft supplies", ahem, necessary materials & commodities).  🙂