New T10 US Premium DD "HULL"

[OldSchoolGaming_Youtube]

I dont know man ... maybe a bit early to call but 3, 203 mm caliber guns on a copy-pasta Sherman ..... with 6.5 km conceal ....  with 41 knot speed (with boost) ...... with 7 km, 5 flac explosions Def AA DD .....with speed boost AND a specialized repair party....? Seems a bit un-balanced, no?

Fun to sail around in your light armored cruiser and this popping up at 6,5 km from your broadside blasting you with 3 citadels every 2.2 seconds (thats without the AR AND Halsey Confederate proc btw).

 

 

Many years ago, the "Work in progress" would usually mean WG would come to their senses and nerf the thing, usually a day before release or some BS. But these days we all know it means it will get buffed just prior to release.

Edited November 12 by OldSchoolGaming_Youtube

[Wolfswetpaws]

That reminds me of something...
 

Spoiler

The Bobby Hull hockey game.
 

  


https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/40565/bobby-hull-hockey-game  

 

[Silence_CN]

25 minutes ago, OldSchoolGaming_Youtube said:

Seems a bit un-balanced, no?

As far as I am concerned, WG is taking the exact same direction with ships that it did with tanks by creating more and more out of the blue prototypes.
In my eyes it's just a headlong rush.

Never mind : the 20th of november gets closer every second. 🙂 

[aleksi111]

Meanwhile Ingame:

3s reload base, less with Main Armament Mod (no-brainer)

 

[aleksi111]

1 hour ago, Silence_CN said:

WG is taking the exact same direction with ships that it did with tanks by creating more and more out of the blue prototypes.

[Unlooky]

2 hours ago, Silence_CN said:

As far as I am concerned, WG is taking the exact same direction with ships that it did with tanks by creating more and more out of the blue prototypes.
In my eyes it's just a headlong rush.

Never mind : the 20th of november gets closer every second. 🙂 

More out of the blue prototypes... by adding a ship that actually existed as an 8" cannon test bed?

 

2 hours ago, OldSchoolGaming_Youtube said:

I dont know man ... maybe a bit early to call but 3, 203 mm caliber guns on a copy-pasta Sherman ..... with 6.5 km conceal ....  with 41 knot speed (with boost) ...... with 7 km, 5 flac explosions Def AA DD .....with speed boost AND a specialized repair party....? Seems a bit un-balanced, no?

It's not going to have smoke, and I doubt it will handle THAT well in open water to become a Marceau 2.0. The Sherman hull is huge and bulky. This seems like an effective second line destroyer to me, free to farm once the enemy DD kills himself. 

 

Of course, I could be completely wrong, but I think it's too early to make any actual judgement until we see it in game. 

[OldSchoolGaming_Youtube]

1 hour ago, ency said:

I believe it has as bad torpedo abilities as T10 DD Sherman has. Bad because bad torpedo angles, like looking only forward between 23:00 and 24:00, so you must swim towards the enemy if you want to be able to send torpedoes out. And those 2+2 torpedoes are quite slow, and small amount, and difficult narrow aiming angles, so the torping part of such ships is irrelevant, it doesn't give anything.

With so bad torpedo tubes you just send them quickly out as a lottery torps, no time and possibility to patiently aim with them, because you must act quickly while swimming towards the target.

Seems similar to Elbing, because higher health pool and stronger AP bullets. Elbing is not effective and popular in Rankeds, and not in often in Randoms either.

As a DD in a MM your role is not to set smoke and start to shoot AP bullets towards cruisers, but to go spot and ket cruisers sit in smoke and shoot, specially in Rankeds small MMs a DD can't it in smoke but must scout. That makes DD AP feature inefficent. And a higher health pool feature is not practical either, because you don't go to do naive mathematical health pool trade with other enemy DDs. The other enemy DDs with their support ships and torps kill all DDs, specially bad manuverability DDs like Elbing.

In my opinion that ship is bad, it officially is titled as a DD in the MM, but actually your team gets with it a bad cruiser. In case the Rankeds MM has only 1 DD, and one team has Elbing/Hull, and the other team any normal concealment DD like Shima or Z52, then the Hull gets outspotted and instantly killed.

So yoy pretty much say that a buffed Sherman would be a bad DD ..... ? Because Sherman is known a very bad DD at T10? 

Sure, Sherman has SAP which fooks with DDs... but Hull will have 203´s which will crap on both DDs (HE) and any radarcruiser (AP) trying to mess up youre game. Imagine sailing out in a Wooster in front of this guy.

Torps are completely irrelevant, same as on Sherman, its not really its selling point, its that Dakka Dakka from hell that is the selling point. That said I usually get some random 16 km torp hits in my Sherman as well, you just spam those suckers on cooldown and now and then get a hit.

[OldSchoolGaming_Youtube]

6 minutes ago, Unlooky said:

It's not going to have smoke, and I doubt it will handle THAT well in open water to become a Marceau 2.0. The Sherman hull is huge and bulky. This seems like an effective second line destroyer to me, free to farm once the enemy DD kills himself. 

No smoke but 15 km range and a special heal. So im not sure which of Hull or Sherman I would prefer to be honest. And Sherman is strong A-F .... and Fun! 

But also, the fact you could sail up close to a cruiser and just Blapp him.

 

6 minutes ago, Unlooky said:

Of course, I could be completely wrong, but I think it's too early to make any actual judgement until we see it in game. 

That it is ..... WG still have plenty of time to buff it .... based on "Silent majority", "holy spreadsheets" and "testing".

 

Edited November 12 by OldSchoolGaming_Youtube

[mashed68]

3 hours ago, OldSchoolGaming_Youtube said:

Fun to sail around in your light armored cruiser and this popping up at 6,5 km from your broadside blasting you with 3 citadels every 2.2 seconds (thats without the AR AND Halsey Confederate proc btw).

*laughs in Napoli* 

[Sumseaman]

8 minutes ago, mashed68 said:

*laughs in Napoli* 

Oh indeed. Can you imagine the climax of Napoli-in-smoke cits?

[mashed68]

1 hour ago, Sumseaman said:

Oh indeed. Can you imagine the climax of Napoli-in-smoke cits?

*laughs in angled Napoli* 😄

[Sumseaman]

37 minutes ago, mashed68 said:

*laughs in angled Napoli* 😄

Oh noes. (ricochet).

[pepe_trueno]

6 hours ago, OldSchoolGaming_Youtube said:

No smoke but 15 km range and a special heal. So im not sure which of Hull or Sherman I would prefer to be honest. And Sherman is strong A-F .... and Fun! 

But also, the fact you could sail up close to a cruiser and just Blapp him.

 

That it is ..... WG still have plenty of time to buff it .... based on "Silent majority", "holy spreadsheets" and "testing".

 

CL uses radar

hull: you want to play rough? OK...

 

[Utt_Bugglier]

22 hours ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

That reminds me of something...
 

  Reveal hidden contents

The Bobby Hull hockey game.
 

  


https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/40565/bobby-hull-hockey-game  

 

No.

Isaac Hull, commander of USS Constitution during its battle vs.HMS Guerierre in which the shout of “Huzzah! Her sides are made of iron!”  rang out, getting her the nickname “Old Ironsides.”

The T11 DD Joshua Humphries is named for the master naval constructor Joshua Humphries, designer of Constitution and for that matter, all six of the first frigates built for the US Navy under the Naval Act of 1794.

Edited November 13 by Utt_Bugglier

[OldSchoolGaming_Youtube]

4 hours ago, pepe_trueno said:

CL uses radar

hull: you want to play rough? OK...

 

I'm foreseeing a lot of these types of incidents happening at T10 with Hull.

 

[OldSchoolGaming_Youtube]

9 hours ago, ency said:

Sherman is little bit better ship than Hull/Elbing because of "smoke+hydro" combo, and secondly because better guns. Such combos are very efficient in the current game version, examples are Cossack and Z42 which have such combo, and Sherman with worse concealment and worse torps but still with that good combo is still playable, but  worse than those 2, if you see an MM where Sherman faces Z42 then he loses because of worst concealment. In general Sherman is not good, but there are even worse choices, mostly those with even worse concealment. That's why it is rare to see Sherman in Rankeds, and if you see then it doesn't perform fine. So, it is bad.

If you Buff Sherman, then it won't get betetr either, for example let's add 1 more torpedo to it, it is still bad, let's add additionally more health points, still bad, let's make AA the best like EU Halland has, still bad, still worse and mainly because of the concealment and bad torps.

But i don't think it is a fine exampel to say that Hull is buffed Sherman, because Hull doesn't have any hydro and any smoke at all as i understand. Both have very bad torps as a similar comparable things, but nothing else. I suggest to ocmpare Hull more with Elbing because of the AP-bulelts feature, and that feature on any DDs is bad.

Sherman is bad, not suitable for Rankeds, and not popular there either. And not popular in randoms either. Why do you think it is good, it is a slow and has bad maneuverability, not a best DD hunter, compared to many other DD hunters, plus if DD hunting fails then his input to the battle is very low.

  

Yes, torps are irrelevant, or say they are not usable, you can compare Hull to Druid that has no torps either.

I don't think the bullet types have any relevance, a ship may have diamond bullets but if his concealment is so bad then he jsut get outspotted and he can't even set a smoke and gets jsut killed.

I think cruiser-minded players may like the idea of DD AP/SAP-bullets, but such feature doesn't have any benefit among DDs, there are much more impactfult features among DDs, starting from concealment, then smoke, and so on.

If it is difficult to ocmprehend that Hull's features and abilities are not competitive, then imagine a duel, where the Hull faces an MM against Z42, or Shima, what would happen? What happens in Rankeds is that Hull gets outspotted and either is kileld by Z42 bullets, or Shima's torps, or support ships behind them. There won't be any sitting behind an island and shooting AP bulelts and making citadel hits, there would be quick instant outspot and death.

 

I can't speak for Ranked or Comp, because I never touch that stuff. I only play Randoms and in Randoms Sherman is pretty much God tier, one just need to search "Sherman" on YT and see the results that pop up. 

Sure, Sherman has smoke+hydro combo and that is great, especially since its long duration US smoke and long range hydro, then you can smoke crawl into a cap and just force any stealthier DD out because they cant do anything about it (unless they have radar support).

But hull will have a specialized repair and even a normal repair on a T10 DD is almost broken/OP since low HP and chance of getting insta nuked for 1 small mistake is one of the balancing factors when it comes to DDs, so if you take that away ..... well!

Regarding the conceal of 6.5 km, is that so bad for a strong gunboat DD at T10? Doesnt Groningen at T9 have the same? Seems like its on par with most of the others or very close. And I dont foresee this being a Cap contester what so ever, this is a 2:nd line DD that will support more stealthy cap contesting DDs (probably by nuking contesting radar cruisers), almost like an Elbing ... but with a Giant heal as well. So this negates the drawback of no hydro. When it comes to its conceal im not really comparing it to the most stealthy DD but more to what it will counter, which is both gunboat DDs but also 9.1 km and above cruisers.

But with 15 km range, speed boost and a heal it will also be great at farming from range and depending on what kind of arcs the guns will have it will probably be possible to even sit behind low islands and farm which negates the drawback of no smoke.

Edited November 13 by OldSchoolGaming_Youtube

[OldSchoolGaming_Youtube]

1 hour ago, ency said:

Sherman's Youtube videos and all other Youtube videos are not a valid argument for me, videos usually demo 1 cherry picked Randoms battle, or other such inadequate methods.

Its kind of a valid argument. EVERYTHING on YT is cherrypicked, but if you get a massive search results on a ship where most titles are something like "Damage record", "Most kills", "300+ K Damage" etc etc its usually a good sign that a ship is strong. Some ships in WOW you can hardly find any videos about or maybe just pre-release videos that shows the ship in port and that usually says its kind of a turd...

 

1 hour ago, ency said:

If a video can demo 10-20 Sprint 1 Golds battle in a row, then, that is better, but even then it just demos playerskills, not the ship so much. For me a more stronger argment is that yesterday i made 20 Rankeds battles and didn't see any Shermans, any Elbings, any Khabas, and during last weeks few hundred in battles i maybe saw 1-2 times those ships. That suggests that those ships are not good. 

Its hard to judge a ship purely based on a very small, restricted mode like Ranked or Sprint. If you would judge purely on that Im guessing the only strong ships is those WG choose to restrict or ban each season. I always base performance of ships in Randoms.

 

1 hour ago, ency said:

But Sherman is out of the topic, it is surel better than the new ship, because smoke+hydro combo is a stronger feature than the features of the new ship.

Also Groningen has the main DD hunting feature "smoke+hydro, it just spots the new DD and sets a smoke and kills it, no matter how much health the new ship has and no matter if he presses the heal button or not and no matter which guns he has.

But we don't know this yet, since we dont know how efficient 203´s on a gunboat DD will be, and we dont know how efficient the Specialized heal will be and how many he gets. Fast firing 203´s shooting any other gunboat DD will probably not only do massive Alpha damage, but also set fires and break every module (Guns as well) on the DD it fights, and also popping a heal that is more like UK cruiser or BB Heal while gunfighting .... well I would probably place my money on Hull.

 

But as we said, this is all just speculations until the ship actually gets released, also seeing if WG choose to buff it even further until then, so lets agree to disagree until then.

 

 

 

[Ensign Cthulhu]

25 minutes ago, OldSchoolGaming_Youtube said:

EVERYTHING on YT is cherrypicked

The upside of a Youtube vid is that the game has already been played and the commenter can talk about the ship's strengths and weaknesses, armour, weapons, etc. without having to pay attention to winning the battle. Those sorts of YT vids are very handy because it's less about showing off than it is about discussing the fine details. 

That being said, a post-NDA and preferably post-release-day stream where I can watch things unfold in real time with no selective editing is a more honest indication of how the ship actually does in battle - although if it's Clan Battles you have to be careful, because the whole team being a single division in real-time voice chat (with the ships pre-chosen to synergize) is a force multiplier for ANY ship (especially and exponentially so for carriers and hybrids, which is why you don't see them there) and it isn't representative of Randoms or Ranked.

Edited November 13 by Ensign Cthulhu

[Wolfswetpaws]

7 hours ago, OldSchoolGaming_Youtube said:

I'm foreseeing a lot of these types of incidents happening at T10 with Hull.

 

Nice.  🙂 
You made good use of your ammo, according to the target being engaged.  👍

The lack of coordination, by the red team, allowed you to hold your position and be a hero.  👍

[Nevermore135]

I ran into a few Hulls in Randoms on the PTS last weekend, all in BB games. The 34mm pen coupled with 14% fire chance on a DD was potent, but the concealment is nothing special, it isn’t particularly fast, and it lacks smoke to set up and farm.

I found it mildly annoying to deal with, but I never really felt particularly threatened by it.

[OldSchoolGaming_Youtube]

OverLordBou