Italian hightier trainer

[Prva_paroplavebná]

Hi all,

I am looking for a hightier Italian premium ship and I need to choose between Lauria and Sicilia as I have resources. Which one is better? 

Another choise is to buy Napoli or Marco Polo for steel... 🤪

What will be Your choise?

Thx.

 

[Frostbow]

Napoli for the sheer fun of it, whether in PVP or in PVE battles. 

11 minutes ago, Prva_paroplavebná said:

Which one is better

 

[Kynami]

Of those two in particular? Sicilia plays much closer to standard Italian battleships and keeps the smoke but comes with HE on the main guns because the secondaries got SAP. Lauria is faster and has bigger guns that keep the SAP, but has no smoke and a weaker armor scheme and is more along the lines of a higher tier Marco Polo. Both have fairly similar winrates. I'd lean slightly towards the Sicilia being the better pick if you only plan to get one of the two.

And I really wouldn't suggest buying the Marco Polo or Napoli with steel.

[Wolfswetpaws]

2 hours ago, Prva_paroplavebná said:

Hi all,

I am looking for a hightier Italian premium ship and I need to choose between Lauria and Sicilia as I have resources. Which one is better? 

Another choise is to buy Napoli or Marco Polo for steel... 🤪

What will be Your choise?

Thx.

 

I have no regrets about welcoming the Napoli to my port.

I don't have the R. Lauria or the Sicilia or the Marco Polo.  So I won't comment on them.

I enjoy the Azur Lane Littorio.  She's an okay ship and a very pleasant Commander to listen to.  But, I may be biased as an anime' fan.

[Itwastuesday]

Why do you need high tier trainer? Isn't it better to train chump captains lowtier?

[Justin_Simpleton]

2 minutes ago, Itwastuesday said:

Why do you need high tier trainer? Isn't it better to train chump captains lowtier?

I bought the Marco Polo with the idea of using it as a trainer.  It doesn't work that way because that ship needs a high skill point captain to give consistent results.  So, the earned CXP is rather small and the credit income is negative.  The same would be for any high tier premium ship.  Napoli is pretty good for getting ribbons and such.

[Wolfswetpaws]

15 minutes ago, Itwastuesday said:

Why do you need high tier trainer? Isn't it better to train chump captains lowtier?

Mid-tier, perhaps?

The VI Duca d'Aosta  comes to mind.  Or the V Genova .  
But the VIII AL Littorio  is more versatile for training Captains, I feel.
 

[Project45_Opytny]

1 hour ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

Mid-tier, perhaps?

The VI Duca d'Aosta  comes to mind.  Or the V Genova .  
But the VIII AL Littorio  is more versatile for training Captains, I feel.
 

I would recommend neither. Duca d'Aosta was an earlier experiment on how Italian cruisers would be and has... not enough in common with researchable Italian cruisers.

AL Littorio should be recommended two weeks earlier due to that one time 81% off (with AL Contents coupon applied) offer, currently she is all but Roma, decorated in a scheme inspired by how the character Littorio (AL) looks like and comes with a 10-pointer commander with special voiceover.

Lauria costs steel, Sicilia Research Points and Marco Polo as well as Napoli coal. I would recommend Marco Polo first if OP just needs a bread earner for credits, then Napoli.

1 hour ago, Justin_Simpleton said:

I bought the Marco Polo with the idea of using it as a trainer.  It doesn't work that way because that ship needs a high skill point captain to give consistent results.

Shouldn't a 14-pointer (to have both concealment and fire prevention) be basically enough for MP, while in contrast it takes full 21pts to fully built a Napoli?

[Ensign Cthulhu]

4 hours ago, Prva_paroplavebná said:

Another choise is to buy Napoli or Marco Polo for steel..

Don't pay steel for coal ships. You will regret it one day.

[Wolfswetpaws]

9 minutes ago, Project45_Opytny said:

1 hour ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

Mid-tier, perhaps?

The VI Duca d'Aosta  comes to mind.  Or the V Genova .  
But the VIII AL Littorio  is more versatile for training Captains, I feel.
 

I would recommend neither. Duca d'Aosta was an earlier experiment on how Italian cruisers would be and has... not enough in common with researchable Italian cruisers.

AL Littorio should be recommended two weeks earlier due to that one time 81% off (with AL Contents coupon applied) offer, currently she is all but Roma, decorated in a scheme inspired by how the character Littorio (AL) looks like and comes with a 10-pointer commander with special voiceover.

Lauria costs steel, Sicilia Research Points and Marco Polo as well as Napoli coal. I would recommend Marco Polo first if OP just needs a bread earner for credits, then Napoli.

I'll grant you the "two weeks earlier due to..." the coupon opportunity.
But, the creator of this topic posted the topic today instead of two weeks ago.  So, that cannot be helped.

Meanwhile, the window of opportunity to participate in this 6th. Wave Azur Lane collaboration event is slowly closing. 
So, the choice belongs to @Prva_paroplavebná. 

https://worldofwarships.com/en/news/sales-and-events/azur-lane-wave-6/
https://worldofwarships.com/en/news/general-news/azur-lane-event-pass-134/

The mid-tier Italian cruisers, Duca d'Aosta and Genova are affordable, but also limiting.
The Genova cannot participate in Scenario Operations.
The Duca d'Aosta eventually becomes a ship that a player has less need to play, because the player has progressed to higher tiers and are more often playing in tier-8 or higher battles (which provide the potential for more rewards per battle).
Which brings me back to why the Littorio is among my candidates, because she can participate in Co-op, random, and Scenario Operation game modes.

The Roma, before her credits earnings potential was nerfed by changes to the Kobayashi "Beer Can" camouflage, might have made my list.
Sadly, changes in-game have ended that era of Roma's prosperity, in my opinion.
 

[Wolfswetpaws]

22 minutes ago, Project45_Opytny said:

Shouldn't a 14-pointer (to have both concealment and fire prevention) be basically enough for MP, while in contrast it takes full 21pts to fully built a Napoli?

The Napoli doesn't need a 21 point Captain, in my opinion.
Like other Italian Cruisers, the Napoli simply needs the rudder-shift hull modules and a 10 point Captain to access one 4-point Captain's skill.
Thus, she's equipped to dodge ordnance and troll the aim of other players.
With a bit of luck, she can get close enough to really annoy the red-team with secondary-battery gunfire.  🙂 

[ArIskandir]

Napoli is great man, and doesn't need a fancy Captain, Nice trainer.

[Project45_Opytny]

29 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

The Roma, before her credits earnings potential was nerfed by changes to the Kobayashi "Beer Can" camouflage, might have made my list.
Sadly, changes in-game have ended that era of Roma's prosperity, in my opinion.

Roma's base enhanced earning coefficient as a T8 premium should never been changed, it's just no longer possible to pay some more to upgrade Roma's economic potential to a De Luxe version. This is moot (as currently only by account trading, which is prohibited by the EULA, can a new player acquire "De Luxe" Roma) I think.

[Unlooky]

On 6/4/2024 at 9:23 AM, Wolfswetpaws said:

The Napoli doesn't need a 21 point Captain, in my opinion.
Like other Italian Cruisers, the Napoli simply needs the rudder-shift hull modules and a 10 point Captain to access one 4-point Captain's skill.
Thus, she's equipped to dodge ordnance and troll the aim of other players.
With a bit of luck, she can get close enough to really annoy the red-team with secondary-battery gunfire.  🙂 

Not true. Without even one of SI, AR, or the secondary skill, Napoli's performance seriously suffers. I'd consider a 16 point build to be the absolute baseline, and TGG massively helps on Napoli as well, so we're looking at a 20 point near mandatory build. 

[ArIskandir]

54 minutes ago, Unlooky said:

Not true. Without even one of SI, AR, or the secondary skill, Napoli's performance seriously suffers. I'd consider a 16 point build to be the absolute baseline, and TGG massively helps on Napoli as well, so we're looking at a 20 point near mandatory build. 

That's deeply subjective, I find a 10-13 pt build perfecty workable for not competitive environments. 

[Admiral_Karasu]

11 minutes ago, ArIskandir said:

That's deeply subjective, I find a 10-13 pt build perfecty workable for not competitive environments. 

For mid tiers, up to 8 I think 10 pts is good enough as it allows you to pick one 4 pt skill (often CE). Further down, it matters even less, even in the case of a .... shall we say, more averagish player like myself.

[Wolfswetpaws]

1 hour ago, Unlooky said:

Not true. Without even one of SI, AR, or the secondary skill, Napoli's performance seriously suffers. I'd consider a 16 point build to be the absolute baseline, and TGG massively helps on Napoli as well, so we're looking at a 20 point near mandatory build. 

Superintendent provides one extra charge of the consumables.
Adrenaline Rush is a skill I don't take.  (Some are fans of that skill.  I am not.  Agree to disagree about it.)
So, that's 6 skill points I can put elsewhere, or simply not use and thus not need 16 skill points.
Top Grade Gunner is for a specific build-path.  It doens't hurt, but it also isn't necessary for a generic cruiser build.

So, I'm having just as much fun without obsessing over the other six to ten skill points that you consider important.
I support the notion of you having fun in your own preferred way.  I'm just on a different wavelength, it seems.  🙂 
 

[thornzero]

42 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

Adrenaline Rush is a skill I don't take.  (Some are fans of that skill.  I am not.  Agree to disagree about it.)

You're the second person I've seen with this position. I think it was seen on the old forum [according to his calculations it was not worth it]. Sometimes I question the benefits of a second or two but I mostly run it.

[Wolfswetpaws]

5 minutes ago, thornzero said:

You're the second person I've seen with this position. I think it was seen on the old forum [according to his calculations it was not worth it]. Sometimes I question the benefits of a second or two but I mostly run it.

Yeah, my ship has to be nearly sunk to get the full benefit, and half-sunk to get 10% reload time improvement.
If I play well enough, I'm not even suffering 30% loss of hull points.
Other times, I'm focused by up to 5 opponents simultaneously.
Games vary and "conditional" skills have varying results.  
I figure that 3 skill points can be better used elsewhere.

[MBT808]

On 6/4/2024 at 3:47 AM, Kynami said:

And I really wouldn't suggest buying the Marco Polo or Napoli with steel

No need to really since their both coal ships.

[Unlooky]

2 hours ago, ArIskandir said:

That's deeply subjective, I find a 10-13 pt build perfecty workable for not competitive environments. 

I'd agree if it was any other cruiser. Unfortunately Napoli relies so heavily on her secondaries for actual damage output that playing without the increased range is simply putting yourself at a significant disadvantage. 

 

2 hours ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

Superintendent provides one extra charge of the consumables.
Adrenaline Rush is a skill I don't take.  (Some are fans of that skill.  I am not.  Agree to disagree about it.)
So, that's 6 skill points I can put elsewhere, or simply not use and thus not need 16 skill points.
Top Grade Gunner is for a specific build-path.  It doens't hurt, but it also isn't necessary for a generic cruiser build.

Having an extra heal and smoke allows Napoli to play more aggressively and make more HP trades instead of having to conserve the consumables. 

AR is a mandatory skill for pretty much every ship except for CVs imo. 

Top Grade Gunner is extremely useful for Napoli. Perhaps not a must have, but a no brainer pick for sure.  

[mashed68]

Napoli without a doubt. Use steel its fine. Id rather use steel to get coal ships I want then use steel to get steel ships that don't interest me. 

After that Lauria, its unique. 

Sicilia is too much like colombo. 

Marco I have no opinion on, don't know it well enough. 

Edited June 5 by mashed68

[Unlooky]

On 6/4/2024 at 4:29 AM, Prva_paroplavebná said:

Hi all,

I am looking for a hightier Italian premium ship and I need to choose between Lauria and Sicilia as I have resources. Which one is better? 

Another choise is to buy Napoli or Marco Polo for steel... 🤪

What will be Your choise?

Thx.

 

To answer the post, I'd say Lauria.

She only really requires the baseline 10 points, and her build is pretty much just a standard battleship build. It also helps that she's extremely busted. Sicilia benefits from having some secondary skills that isn't really applicable to tech tree Italian BBs. Marco Polo has the issue of not being very good.

Napoli has a unique build which requires a high level of points for a baseline build. It's not sharable with Venezia, so I would advise against Napoli. 

Also, do not waste steel on coal ships, especially on a ship as mediocre as Marco Polo. 

 

Edited June 5 by Unlooky

[Unlooky]

1 hour ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

Yeah, my ship has to be nearly sunk to get the full benefit, and half-sunk to get 10% reload time improvement.
If I play well enough, I'm not even suffering 30% loss of hull points.
Other times, I'm focused by up to 5 opponents simultaneously.
Games vary and "conditional" skills have varying results.  
I figure that 3 skill points can be better used elsewhere.

Obviously my stance is in favor of taking AR, and I disagree with this reasoning.

If I don't lose 30% of my HP in a game, it was either a blowout or I played extremely passively (and therefore poorly.)

Using your HP to gain position or outtrade the enemy is key to WoWs and, in my opinion, is where the true skill in WoWs lies: knowing what you can get away with doing and exploiting it to your advantage. 

So long as I either survived with an active map presence or died making a key play, I consider myself to have played well. 

[AdmiralThunder]

On 6/4/2024 at 1:29 AM, Prva_paroplavebná said:

Hi all,

I am looking for a hightier Italian premium ship and I need to choose between Lauria and Sicilia as I have resources. Which one is better? 

Another choise is to buy Napoli or Marco Polo for steel... 🤪

What will be Your choise?

Thx.

 

NOOOOO! Never, ever, never, ever, ad nauseum exchange Steel for Coal unless it is a very miniscule amount and it is an urgent/desperate situation like a Coal ship is about to be removed. WG totally rips you off on the exchange rate and Steel is way harder to get in quantity. Please don't even consider this. It is one of the biggest No-No's in game.

Lauria is kind of overrated honestly and to me doesn't really play/feel like the Tech Tree BB line (sort of like how Incomparable is different for the British BB's).  Sicilia would be closer as it is basically a buffed Colombo but it has SAP secondary guns and has HE from the main guns which is the reverse of the tech tree ships. Lauria is Steel and Sicilia is RB pts. Expensive ships that aren't ideal trainers for the Tech Tree BB Captains.

Napoli is a very good ship but it is not an ideal trainer for the Tech Tree Cruiser line as Napoli is a secondary build brawler. Ideally you use a high pt Captain from either a BB or DD and only use it on Napoli vs using Captains from the Tech Tree Cruisers. The skills don't match up. Napoli is definitely a ship you want but again it is not ideal as a Captain trainer for the Cruisers because of the skill mismatch.

Marco Polo is probably the best option of the ships you mention for an ITL BB Captain trainer. It has SAP and AP like the Tech Tree BB's and like them you won't want to build for secondaries so skills wise what goes on it would also go on the Tech Tree ships. It also plays basically the same other than it has 406MM guns vs the 381MM guns T7+ for the Tech Tree BB's. 

So, I would go for Marco Polo, purchased with COAL ONLY NOT STEEL, or cash in the Premium shop, if you are looking for a ship to train ITL Tech Tree BB Captains on. It's the best fit.

JMHO.