A player punched his/her monitor after being constantly harassed by submarines in the game

[Type_93]

1 hour ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

Actually, no.

But I'm sure interested in why you seem to support a company doing whatever they want in pursuit of profit...up to and including harming other people.

Do tell why I shouldnt work to stop the evil?

1 hour ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

lol. The company isn’t hurting anyone. People like that have weak self control. But I guess it’s always easier to blame anything but yourself for terrible behavior, especially a big bad company. 

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

27 minutes ago, Type_93 said:

lol. The company isn’t hurting anyone. People like that have weak self control. But I guess it’s always easier to blame anything but yourself for terrible behavior, especially a big bad company. 

Actually, science shows that the free2play gaming model DOES hurt people.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2352853222000104

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9737990/

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10899-021-10042-1

"For Pay-to-Win players and gamblers alike, developing problematic behaviors significantly increases the chances of developing these for the other game form. Across all our analyses, the association with high-risk PGSI-categories is a strong predictor for respondents to increase participation, frequencies and PGSI-scores in the other form. Also in relative measures, the standardized coefficients disclose that the associations with high-risk PGSI-groups present the most influential variables within the different models. This can be interpreted that once a player or gambler has developed a problematic behavioral pattern, that habit is likely to migrate to other game forms."

You may attempt to close your eyes to the increasing costs of gambling disorders on your community...but the rest of the world isn't attempting to stay so naive.

Regulation is coming, just as assuredly as governments went after cigarette companies when the cost of treating the aftermath of smoking became too great...so the costs of dealing with gambling disorders will rise to the point where regulations will come. It's only a matter of time at this point, since everyone involved in the gaming industry seems determined to ignore their responsibilities to grow their business sustainably.

Edited February 1, 2024 by Daniel_Allan_Clark

[Type_93]

21 minutes ago, Daniel_Allan_Clark said:

Actually, science shows that the free2play gaming model DOES hurt people.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2352853222000104

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9737990/

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10899-021-10042-1

"For Pay-to-Win players and gamblers alike, developing problematic behaviors significantly increases the chances of developing these for the other game form. Across all our analyses, the association with high-risk PGSI-categories is a strong predictor for respondents to increase participation, frequencies and PGSI-scores in the other form. Also in relative measures, the standardized coefficients disclose that the associations with high-risk PGSI-groups present the most influential variables within the different models. This can be interpreted that once a player or gambler has developed a problematic behavioral pattern, that habit is likely to migrate to other game forms."

You may attempt to close your eyes to the increasing costs of gambling disorders on your community...but the rest of the world isn't attempting to stay so naive.

Regulation is coming, just as assuredly as governments went after cigarette companies when the cost of treating the aftermath of smoking became too great...so the costs of dealing with gambling disorders will rise to the point where regulations will come. It's only a matter of time at this point, since everyone involved in the gaming industry seems determined to ignore their responsibilities to grow their business sustainably.

Again, blaming companies for an individual’s lack of restraint. Anything to avoid taking responsibility for one’s own actions. 
And pointing out “Scientific” studies from the internet is just lame. You could search for studies proving Jesus lived with dinosaurs and prolly find few.  

[Verytis]

Eh, I've damaged my own equipment once upon a time. Really this is just a chance to learn through bitter experience.

That you shouldn't let some POS manipulate you into destroying your own assets.

It is not your belongings that deserve your anger.

 

 

2 hours ago, Type_93 said:

lol. The company isn’t hurting anyone. People like that have weak self control. But I guess it’s always easier to blame anything but yourself for terrible behavior, especially a big bad company. 

TBF the company acts as an enabler. It takes both a person and company.

Where its up for debate is whether the benefits outweigh the potential harm, and how much we can trust people to control themselves.

[Snargfargle]

I've actually seen players get to arguing so much in chat that they forgot all about playing the game. Once, so many players were arguing in chat and not shooting at each other's ships that the rest of us noticed and became so engrossed by the argument that we weren't doing much shooting either. I think my team finally won because we had an extra cap but hardly a shell was fired in the last several minutes of the match.

 

[clammboy]

Can someone put this thread to bed it’s kind of embarrassing?

Edited February 1, 2024 by clammboy

[Snargfargle]

[CaliburxZero]

Clearly subs offer a very fun and engaging experience for everyone who must deal with them.

/s

Outside of the players who likes to use them as tools to make the game awful (arguably even easier than CVs, and that's REALLY saying something) I don't think anybody truly enjoys them being here.

Of course... Certain (minority) groups who bark quite loudly will say otherwise.  

[Daniel_Allan_Clark]

3 hours ago, clammboy said:

Can someone but this thread to bed it’s kind of embarrassing?

I think it's already there. We've already hit the point of people just repeating their old positions rather than engage in a constructive way.

I would really encourage everyone to go read about the effects of gambling on their community. If you won't take it from me, do your own research.

If anything so that we won't be surprised when the politicians start cracking down in heavyhanded ways and can advocate for reasonable rules and controls.

Denying reality and sticking our heads in the sand about this won't stop the changes that are coming.

[Jakob Knight]

1 hour ago, CaliburxZero said:

Clearly subs offer a very fun and engaging experience for everyone who must deal with them.

/s

Outside of the players who likes to use them as tools to make the game awful (arguably even easier than CVs, and that's REALLY saying something) I don't think anybody truly enjoys them being here.

Of course... Certain (minority) groups who bark quite loudly will say otherwise.  

 

It could be argued that it is the ones with a bias against a certain kind of ship that are the minority barking the loudest because, obviously, they are the loudest voice in the room.  When reason and debate are ignored in favor of emotion and intractability, it is difficult to do more than simply shrug and say 'well, that's your opinion' and let people believe what they want to in order to get back to enjoying the game/doing what your doing.  That's the point I've gotten to after wasting countless posts on such subject, and deciding that if people want to hate something, I can't convince them to give up their hate.  They like hate too much to give it up in the face of reason.

 

[Yedwy]

19 hours ago, Admiral_Karasu said:

My Kitakami is good for eliciting feelings of pity.

You just need to let the notion of carrying the potatoes go, then it becomes something amazing

[CaliburxZero]

1 hour ago, Jakob Knight said:

 

It could be argued that it is the ones with a bias against a certain kind of ship that are the minority barking the loudest because, obviously, they are the loudest voice in the room.  When reason and debate are ignored in favor of emotion and intractability, it is difficult to do more than simply shrug and say 'well, that's your opinion' and let people believe what they want to in order to get back to enjoying the game/doing what your doing.  That's the point I've gotten to after wasting countless posts on such subject, and deciding that if people want to hate something, I can't convince them to give up their hate.  They like hate too much to give it up in the face of reason.

 

Just like how RTS carriers were liked and not hated, right?  Sure.  Subs are always defended by the same group of people,a group that only exists on forums like these.  I see the same negative opinion in game of subs as well as in streams, and on any forums that aren't moderated by WG to protect opinions of certain types of players and this same tired gaslighting opinions of how the hate was just a minority was thrusted on me and others for all of CVs right until it hit such a critical point in how hated they were WG came out and had to do the rework.

That same reasoning you just tried to throw at me should be used for yourself.  You'll defend no matter what, and you know your opinion is protected irregardless of facts or logic.  I can easily talk about why subs are hated from a gameplay perspective but we know you would not listen to that so I won't waste my time.

 

Guess why most good players have left and why we are on here instead of the original forums?  Guess why WG may take away most plane spotting?  It's all the same thing.  You believe what you want.  The game will continue to lose profitability and changes will be made time and again when the game does poorly enough, but the problem is those players who left mostly won't come back.  

Some things never change.

PS: Hated = Unbalanced.  Players who understand and can perform in a game always call out the OP or unfair stuff.  This game is no different from any other game community in this regard.  But such a inconvenient fact is ignored in this community... I wonder why.

Edited February 1, 2024 by CaliburxZero

[Admiral_Karasu]

Well I never hated the RTS carriers. I'd prefer to go back to them if WG adressed the actual issues there was with them.

[Ensign Cthulhu]

9 minutes ago, Admiral_Karasu said:

I'd prefer to go back to them if WG adressed the actual issues there was with them.

The issues included:

An obscene degree of spotting, e.g. being able to leave aircraft that had expended their weapons up as permanent spotters, and to detect torpedoes inbound.

An ability to act in multiple places at once on the same map, giving those who could multitask under pressure an unnatural advantage.

Being able to pile multiple squadrons on a target for an unavoidable cross-drop or devstrike.

Skilled fighter users being able to deplane the other CV with fighters and make it a useless impediment.

 

All those things were addressed with the rework. It was the only way to rebalance people like Farazelleth and Femennenly.

 

[Snargfargle]

20 minutes ago, Ensign Cthulhu said:

The issues included...

Before the CV rework, CVs got to be very rare but if they were present in a match and you saw that only one was a unicum then you might as well have just tabbed out and watched YouTube videos because nothing you were going to do was going to make your team win the game. The unicum, usually playing a Premium ship that had more squadrons of fighters than the stock ship their opponent was playing, would strafe all of the "lesser player's" planes out of existence then proceed to Alpha-strike the BBs on your team one after another until they were all gone. Sure, if you had an AA-spec's Des Moines or Worcester then you, yourself, probably wouldn't be attacked by the CV but you would still lose because of the 3-1 advantage the unicum CV had given their team in about five minutes. 

Case in point:

 

Edited February 1, 2024 by Snargfargle

[Ensign Cthulhu]

2 minutes ago, Snargfargle said:

The unicum, usually playing a Premium ship that had more squadrons of fighters than the stock ship their opponent was playing, would strafe all of the "lesser player's" planes out of existence

This is one of the reasons I didn't ever want to play RTS carriers in Randoms. I got chewed up too badly. These days, I have Audacious, Midway, Hakuryu in port and MVR is one of my grind targets for this year. Now if only I could make Pobeda work...

[Admiral_Karasu]

7 minutes ago, Ensign Cthulhu said:

This is one of the reasons I didn't ever want to play RTS carriers in Randoms. I got chewed up too badly. These days, I have Audacious, Midway, Hakuryu in port and MVR is one of my grind targets for this year. Now if only I could make Pobeda work...

Have you tried a sledge hammer? The trick works in movies anyway...

[Wolfswetpaws]

7 hours ago, Verytis said:

It is not your belongings that deserve your anger.

👍

 

[Wolfswetpaws]

https://toonups.com/poster/equipment-abuse/
 

[Snargfargle]

5 minutes ago, Wolfswetpaws said:

As you well know, the military tends to beat the bejesus out of its equipment. When I was on maneuvers at Irwin I took every opportunity I could to "off road" in what ever vehicle I could con someone into letting me drive. Once I ran into a small rock outcropping. The vehicle commander said, "Dammit, 'Doc, you hit a rock. I said "Yeah... with a tank." We got out and looked. It barely scratched the paint. The sergeant major told me to stop driving the tank around as it was against the Geneva Conventions but it was OK, I had my own track to drive anyway.

[Jakob Knight]

53 minutes ago, CaliburxZero said:

Just like how RTS carriers were liked and not hated, right?  Sure.  Subs are always defended by the same group of people,a group that only exists on forums like these.  I see the same negative opinion in game of subs as well as in streams, and on any forums that aren't moderated by WG to protect opinions of certain types of players and this same tired gaslighting opinions of how the hate was just a minority was thrusted on me and others for all of CVs right until it hit such a critical point in how hated they were WG came out and had to do the rework.

That same reasoning you just tried to throw at me should be used for yourself.  You'll defend no matter what, and you know your opinion is protected irregardless of facts or logic.  I can easily talk about why subs are hated from a gameplay perspective but we know you would not listen to that so I won't waste my time.

 

Guess why most good players have left and why we are on here instead of the original forums?  Guess why WG may take away most plane spotting?  It's all the same thing.  You believe what you want.  The game will continue to lose profitability and changes will be made time and again when the game does poorly enough, but the problem is those players who left mostly won't come back.  

Some things never change.

PS: Hated = Unbalanced.  Players who understand and can perform in a game always call out the OP or unfair stuff.  This game is no different from any other game community in this regard.  But such a inconvenient fact is ignored in this community... I wonder why.

 

Perhaps because the opinion you hold to is wrong?  By not considering that possibility, you will often end up not understanding why your 'facts' are not recognized by others.

 

As a point of note, you claim I will defend 'no matter what', yet I and others have criticized WG on aspects of the game that make no sense from a game perspective.  You claim that certain types of ship are 'protected regardless of facts or logic', yet facts and logic largely support the reasons those types of ship are the way they are and they tend to disprove much of the criticism posted about them.  Are CVs and Subs in the game as they should be?  No, and we all would like to see changes.  However, just assuming anyone who likes them is somehow gaslighting is a bit shortsighted.

 

And yes, I apply all the considerations I ask of others to my own views to self check myself because I know I can be wrong.  I admit when I am proven wrong  and have no ego to worry about because I care about the truth more than myself or my preferences.  Perhaps, as you recommend for me, you should likewise consider and check your own reasoning.

 

As I said, I have long tired of trying to get others to give up their groundless hatred and I only reply at length here because you made several incorrect assertions about myself that needed correction.  Beyond that, it is your responsibility to apply reason and logic in all you do, and any failing in that regard will be yours to bear.  I am always up for honest debate, but not for pointless hate and conspiracy theories.  We have too much of that in our world already.

 

 

[Ensign Cthulhu]

34 minutes ago, Admiral_Karasu said:

Have you tried a sledge hammer?

To do what? Go aboard and break up the crew's hidden vodka stash? 😜

Someone, it might have been me, suggested that the Wednesday evening NA WG stream take a look at the Pobeda and from the way Ahskance reacted you'd think he'd rather do anything else, yet the RU carriers are supposed to be what everyone screams "OP!" about the most. But I'll have to try something, because bad language certainly isn't working! 

[HogHammer]

 

[Admiral_Karasu]

23 minutes ago, Ensign Cthulhu said:

To do what? Go aboard and break up the crew's hidden vodka stash? 😜

Someone, it might have been me, suggested that the Wednesday evening NA WG stream take a look at the Pobeda and from the way Ahskance reacted you'd think he'd rather do anything else, yet the RU carriers are supposed to be what everyone screams "OP!" about the most. But I'll have to try something, because bad language certainly isn't working! 

You really need to practice your cursing. Perhaps spend some time watching Flamu?

[Col_NASTY]

1 hour ago, HogHammer said: